Feral dogs , strays and town dogs

[Ragged Robin]

I am starting a new thread because I thought we were having a useful, and largely unacrimonious discussion on the "Town Dogs" thread when it was closed, although I cannot see which rule it broke, and several people were involved in the discussions.

As someone who can't get about much I found it informative and several constructive and useful suggestions were made. It it is always good to have a sensible discussion and to see other points of view including those of "non dog" people, who have a right to their say. I had not previously realised the risk of tripping for the infirm despite my own problems (probably because I am used to avoiding three dogs permanently underfoot!) But I still think for the major problem with dogs in public places is the risk of transmission of disease and parasites - particularly to children, though I do appreciate the problems involved in treating a stray population.

Dogs are pack animals, but they are also the animals emotionally nearest to humans. They also need exercise. Priority should be given to enable more adoption or fostering , failing which if they have to be enclosed it should be somewhere they have freedom to run and play safely for both themselves and human.

I hope someone will use this thread, or start a new one to keep us informed on developments of the Girne town dogs, and the plight of strays in other areas.

[Heaven]

I have had dogs for 23 years in England and I have to say I was so pleased when Girne Belidiyese took the dogs from Girne as I have seen them chasing Turkish men down the street, urinating over the legs of chairs in the top of Girne cafes, fouling lovely areas etc. So I have not eaten in these cafes for nearly 2 years. I AM A DOG LOVER, but do not agree with stray dogs or Kar s ethos as dogs need companionship and constant caring. What does it take for ex pats to address this situation. It was not so many years ago that expats were complaining about stray dogs, Kar say they cannot take anymore and when the council do something, people complain! The council cannot win. There is a different culture here re animals and we have to respect , take themALL on or stop criticising. A vast majority of the locals are afraid of dogs. I am afraid of growling dogs that follow you. Do not get at me for my opinion.

[Cally]

I think the difference between KAR rounding up strays for confinement & the local Belidiyese is the problem. Kar will treat the dogs/cats well by feeding properly & supplying adequate shelter & where possible human interaction. I think we know that will not happen with the local Belidiyese as shown in Tatlisu, where there is still not adequate shelter, they were given 2 large kennels & to my knowledge they are still outside the pound. They were eventually found starving, with a deceased dog in the pound & faeces everywhere. The one just set up in Kyrenia is so far off the beaten track & mainly inaccessible to the public so who will be checking on the welfare of these poor souls.

[turtle]

So why was the thread closed ?

From what I can see the last 10 or 12 posts were set by no less than 7 posters... not 2 as suggested ?
What is wrong with moderation on this forum, why can't adult human beings have a normal conversation without some mod pulling the plug.

Conversations just fade away naturally so why don't you allow it to, this thread was causing no harm or distress and the silly suggestion to start another thread will only end with that being closed AGAIN.

Ooooohh it makes me angry..

[Ragged Robin]

Thank you Turtle. I must say I was upset as one of the main and the last poster I assume I was one of the two accused of conducting a personal conversation, though actually I had one with three other posters and anyway I see nothing against it the rules provided others can intervene as they think fit.

I think that considering the highly emotive subject, the thread was a model of restraint compared with some others here, and nobody was being personally abusive (except once which I am sure was meant and taken in fun, and I found welcome light relief!)

Heaven : I respect you views, although I only partially agree. The ideal is for the dogs to be adopted but there are too many strays and too few people who are willing AND ABLE to undertake the cost, time and trouble it involves. One of the things people forget about strays is that they restrict the places people can take adopted dogs - and that is becoming increasingly limited as it is.

There is little expats can do- we really should be careful about criticizing let alone changing local customs and attitudes. And there is so much divergence of opinion among expats. At least by constructive discussion and suggestions and airing all points of view and interests we may eventually reach some kind of compromise which will enable us to set an example of responsible animal welfare, influence opinion and maybe work more with and help those Cypriots who DO care about animals and are trying to do something.

[Ragged Robin]

Cally: I think the reason that the authoriites' pounds are "off the beaten track" is the same as KARs also being. People object to the barking. Unfortunate, especially for those of whose who would like to visit and see for ourselves. Catch 22.

[snd1966]

KAR policy neuter and return would of worked if when started education was in place and no more un neutered animals were just allowed to breed without control. There are too many dogs / cats for the people who can, want or even like them and with all the new breeds here I dread to see what it will be like if the government do not get them off the streets.

Heaven has a point about criticizing I remember all those years ago the foreign pack moaned about cats around a restaurant and eventually when the owner mixed up a 'nice' last meal for them he could not understand why the people were so upset as he did exactly what he was asked.

I just wish neutering was more acceptable and free and maybe then the problem in another 10 yeas will reduce, an opportunity greatly lost when KAR started their policy when the population of humans weren't here adding to it. Can anyone imagine how many animals would be on the island now!

[tomsteel]

I read somewhere of an American system of neutering male dogs by a one-time injection at 2/5ths of the cost by surgery, no infection risk or post-op surgical problems, cone collar or need for sitches removal. I wonder if the Cypriot authorities would sanction its import and use here? I think the product used is called Neutersol or Zueterin. Not sure if injection available for bitches. This might reduce the numbers.

[sophie]

The reason the KAR Centre (and if anyone was go up there now and see the huge improvements, you could see why it certainly isn't a pound as we know the word) is because we were "given" the land (KAR doesn't own it and Forestry Commission still keep a very close eye on what KAR does or doesn't do) This result is that it is well out of the way of human habitation, built on a slope, was difficult to access, no mains water and very inconvenient in many other ways. Having said that KAR are grateful for anything. The Girne set up as and when it comes to being is for the same reason although it isn't as far away from properties as KAR is. However I don't know whether the Girne Belediye have been gifted the land or whether it is Government land. Either way you can bet your bottom dollar it will have much easy access and most if not all facilities, which is good of course and should make viewing the dogs much more simple.

[Cally]

If that is the case Sophie about the Girne compound then that is good.

[Ragged Robin]

I wasnt criticising KAR - just stating the fact that if you have a lot of dogs you get barking and consequently complaints. I rememeber when KAR were situated in Alsancak/Karaoğlanoğlu in a lovely place (near a stables if I remember correctly), and much more accessibe for volunteers and visitors, but there were lots of complaints about noise, which is why they were offered the place in the mountains.

I would love to visit it, but with an old low performance car , not to mention wallking difficulties , it is impossible. And even if someone was kind enough offered me a lift, I would not be able to stay long, as my own dogs have to be kept indoors when I am out, because otherwise they attract complaints by barking at fat overfed unneutered stray cats which pester them and me. Sometimes you just cant win!

[Ragged Robin]

Tom Steel: There used to be an injection available for bitches. I thought about it for one of my earlier bitches, but it only made them sterile , did not stop them coming into season, and had to be repeated at regular intervals. I am not sure if it prevented them attracting males, the advantage of neutering males would also be it stopped them congregating round females in season, but I suspect it would be seen as sexist! Also it is usually easier to catch the female strays in the first place!

[Ragged Robin]

Neither of the dogs I had "done" needed cone collars, and both were up and running about happily as soon as the aneasthetic wore off - and one of those was about 18 years ago!

The first bitch was much more difficult, but the last one I had done (about 3 years ago) was also up and running hours later, had the tiniest of "wounds", didnt need a "cone", stitches did not need removing and there is no scar. I assume this is a new procedure - some kind of "keyhole" surgery? I was very impressed - the Vet was Pertev btw.

I think neutering would be more acceptable , particularly by some of the locals who really cannot afford it, if it was not so expensive - if there are restrictions on Vet's charges, why not grant at least a year's free registration for neutered dogs of either sex?

[Mozgor]

I know I've posted about this before, but feel the need to point out again that the assumption all Belediye pounds are/will be the same is incorrect.

Famagusta Barinak is being constructed to EU standards and was planned years ago. Construction started in 2014 and is nearing completion. There will be a dedicated rehabilitation building for 50 dogs with separate indoor and outdoor runs that can be shut off if need be with sliding louvred shutters. It also has 12 blocks with shelter for each dog, including a kennel for each dog. Ok the funds for the kennels were raised by a local charity, but this is where we can help support the Belediyesi by providing kennels, bedding etc. There is also an 'office' block which will contain an operating room, reception area, examination rooms, office and nursery. In addition, there is a fenced off area which will be the intake are for dogs where they will be quarantined to ensure no diseases are spread.

We can only hope that the other Belediyesi follow the same standard as has been set by The Mayor of Famagusta in his initiative as an animal lover to provide a fit for purpose pound for the stray dogs in his area.

Moyra

[Owl Lady]

Hi Moyra, hope to make it to see the kennels etc with Cally later in the year. Promise to(try)not to be in plaster or a wheel chair !!!