UK Government Pensions - Paid direct to Turkish Bank

[waddo]

Question - Do you receive a UK Government Pension of any kind, if the answer is no then the rest of the questions are not worth reading!!

Question - Do you own property or rent/lease property and do you live here full time?

Question - Have you considered having your pension paid directly into a local bank here?

For information, in case you didn't know, all Government Pensions can be paid directly into a bank of your choice in the country where you now live. There is a small catch - the Government Pensions paid in Sterling are all paid by the Government into Citibank UK. Citibank UK will only pay that pension to the bank of your choice in the currency of the country you live in!

This means that Citibank convert your Sterling payments into Turkish Lira - at what they say is the best rate available from them at the time - and then pay that into your local bank account.

To me this system is setup to make money for Citibank and the receiving bank and to ensure you will only be able to receive your pension/s in Turkish Lira.

I am just wondering if there is anybody who lives here permanently that has their Government pensions paid directly into a local bank please??

[tutor4u]

Would not advise it , remember the Greek Haircut, bank closures .

https://cyprus-mail.com/2023/11/09/in-l ... thousands/

Not for me, UK bank and transfer to Wise/Revolute etc for every day bills.

History tends to repeat its self due to poor management and greed.

[gates]

The money gets changed from £ to lira in uk bank then forward her

[tutor4u]

The money gets changed from £ to lira in uk bank then forward her

And a charge for doing that.

[waddo]

I fully agree that the best way starts with having a UK bank account! However, all UK banks are now aggressively chasing down and closing accounts of people who do not live in the UK! I know this as a fact as Nationwide have an Accounts Review Team that is very active in that area - hence I no longer have nor can get any UK Bank Account!

Gates, correct, Citibank UK change the Sterling pension into the currency of the country in which the pensioner lives and then forwards that amount the the local bank of the pensioner.

As no bank operates for free, Citibank must also charge a fee - deducted from the pension amount - prior to forwarding! I have not been able to ascertain how much that fee is as Citibank will not enter into correspondence with me as yet.

Additionally the local bank of the pensioner will make a charge for accepting the pension and placing it into the pensioners account!

I would still like to know if there is anyone who receives their pension direct from the Government provider?

[gates]

Get a Wise account easy

[waddo]

To get a Wise account you need a UK address?

[Mowgli597]

To get a Wise account you need a UK address?

I don’t believe so. I have an Irish address and have Wise accounts in Euro, Sterling, US dollars (which I didn’t ask for - it seems to come as standard) and recently a TL account which we now use for everyday spending here.
But our pensions are paid into a U.K. account and an Irish one so that may not help you.

[Mowgli597]

From https://wise.com/gb/account/gbp-account

“British pound sterling bank account vs Wise account

If you need to send, receive, and hold GBP you may be able to open a British pound sterling bank account with your normal bank. That means you can transact in British pounds sterling from wherever you call home, without needing a local address overseas.

Wise accounts are a great alternative. Use the British pound sterling details which come with a Wise account to safely receive money in British pounds sterling, which you can convert to spend conveniently in the UK. Wise converts at the mid-market rate with no hidden fees.” (My emphasis)

[waddo]

Direct from the Wise Web Site - "Wise works under several legal entities worldwide. Your registered address determines where your account is based, and what terms and conditions apply." - This means that as my registered address is in the TRNC - which Wise see as being part of Turkey - I can only hold base my Wise account in Turkish Lira!!

So, back around the the loop I go - I can't have a UK Bank Account because I do not live there and because I am a BritishCitizen, if I was a foreign national then I could open a UK Bank Account and not live in the UK! If you think that is crazy then you have joined the club of Confused.com along with myself - lol. I understand that it is all about income tax and where you are tax resident because banks need to be very careful about money laundering. I pay income tax in the UK because all my tax is deducted at source before my pensions are paid - hence I am tax resident in the UK!

I find today that as I asked questions of Wise some months ago I now have a Wise account in Turkey, I can't have a Wise card as Wise cards are not available in Turkey! Wise will not talk to me about living in the TRNC either, why am I not surprised at that - lol.

There has to be an answer out there, guess I am not asking the right questions to start with - I will keep trying. Thanks for the help.

[gates]

Can’t you register your account to a family member’s address easy

[waddo]

Gates - If it was that easy then everyone would do it! If you want a UK Bank account you have to provide proof of residence in the UK, that means you have to produce evidence that YOU and not your family member actually pay the bills there, such bills as council tax/electricity/gas etc are normal to be asked for. Those bills will be in the family members name and not yours!! Good try mate but the rules have changed a lot since Brexit and even if you want to tell lies to get an account, it is difficult to get one that way as well. I will keep banging away at the problem but moving money from one country to another is getting harder by the day.

[Mowgli597]

Waddo. Is your pension currently paid into a U.K. bank? If so could you not just change the address to a relative in the U.K. without the need to show utility bills etc?
Not strictly kosher I know

[waddo]

Currently paid into Revolut - dare not change the address in case they ask questions I don't want to answer - lol. Just trying to find a more "legal" way to bank before I am forced to have my pensions paid into local bank by Citibank!! The drop in pensions if I have to do that would mean I would have to seriously look at leaving! Good old Brexit - lol.

[gates]

Well i have both . Think you are trying to make more of it

[alphamike]

Is there a reason why you can't stay with Revolut as they now have a UK banking licence....or is that the problem?

[waddo]

Alphamike, I can stay with Revolut till they find out I am not living in the UK! Having been put in the position of no bank in the UK by Nationwide and been given 21 days to sort out a new bank - between the 26th of December 2023 and the 15th of January 2024 - when all Government departments were closed between the 24th Dec to the 3rd of January anyway, it was a most traumatic time! I have no wish to find myself in that situation again and am simply trying to find a LEGAL (Gates please take note of that word) method of having a UK bank account OR any information regarding Government Pension Transfer costs into a local bank here!

I am well aware that many expats have UK Bank Accounts and use a family members address- to be blunt, they lie about where they live as did I - and that works right up to the point where it no longer does! Revolut are trying to help by allowing me to have an account based in Turkey and are looking into the possibility of my country of residence being Cyprus as well. That would mean I could have a Revolut card for Cyprus and have a GBP account as well. The problem then is still to get my pensions paid into it in GBP. The banking system is crazy and there to make lots of money for the banks but there probably will be away around it, just not found it yet - lol.

Gates, what do you mean by I am trying to make more of it? The law is the law, it’s simple!

[alphamike]

Yes understand your predicament Waddo. It's not actually illegal to have a UK bank account, more that the banks don't want the hassle since Brexit and why they've been cutting people off. It really is nuts that the state pension isn't paid out in Sterling, definitely a money maker for Citibank, and certainly not in your favour. Let's just hope that Revolut can help you out. I can't help with Govt pension as not quite got there yet, and probably won't be here anyway, the way things are going.

[kerry 6138]

https://britishexpatmoney.com/2018/06/2 ... nts/?amp=1

[munchy]

I totally sympathise with you Waddo. We too had a UK Bank account but we had no Address in the UK. For years we were hounded for information regarding our status in TRNC, and , indeed, our 1 and only Joint account was CLOSED Abruptly on 2 occasions usually prior to a Holiday period. The time and money spent dealing with this scenario caused us immense stress as we had no other way to access money. But for the kindness of our Friends in TRNC we don't know how we would have survived. On top of the exorbitant Bank charges every year , the whole Business was a nightmare.
Using our Son's UK adddress as CORRESPONDENCE only worked for a while. The overriding problems are of course the Pension Payments and the good people of this Forum have tried hard to help in that regard. As I am now in the UK I cannot help further but I hope you ultimately find a solution.

[waddo]

alphamike, the legality issue is true I am afraid. When you fill in the application for an account you are also stating where you live and if you give an address but don't actually live there then - according to the solicitors - you have committed a falsehood and can be taken to court for that act alone. I know that the banks are just making money out of people and that there is no law that prevents a UK citizen having a UK account but like a lot of things - it is up to the provider to allow it and they now don't! Hey ho, that is life but there will be a way as I know I am just one of thousands in the same position. The most annoying part for us is that Nationwide were kept informed of our location at all times and agreed that we could retain our accounts even though we lived abroad on a permanent basis. Now the cover your a**e is in full swing with the Accounts Review Team who have declared that we failed to meet the criteria to retain our accounts - they refuse to tell us how we failed and what we failed - but instead just said it was because we live abroad. The most galling part of the whole thing is that they now have stated on their own web site that you can retain your account if you move abroad - we can't because our accounts have been closed! Catch 22. Take care out there.

[Mimi2]

Waddo have you considered a Wise account. Turkey & Cyprus are in their list.
Not sure if it would work for you, but maybe worth a look

[waddo]

Mimi2, I already have a Wise account for Turkey. Wise do not issue cards to Turkey yet so it is of little value and gives me the same money transfer problems as Citibank. Looking at changing it to a Cyprus account which would be safer as pensions would then be paid in Euros but Citibank charges will still apply. Might be worth a shot, still waiting for information from Wise.

[alphamike]

That is really rotten how Nationwide have treated you Waddo, am at a loss for words. Sorry have no other suggestions.

[waddo]

I have emailed Nationwide and asked what "criteria" I failed to meet - before I go down the FOI route with them. Nothing to lose and their answers may help other folks who fall into the same situation. Never give up the fight - lol.

[Reyntj]

What about turkish bank? You know the one that has branches here and in london?

Dont know their criteria just an idea.

[Reyntj]

https://www.turkishbank.co.uk/personal/ ... -personal/

I cant find their criteria but they do have a non resident fee section..!!! There is a £200 set up fee and £10 per month charge. I fired them an email might try and visit a local branch.

Im in this limbo with a revolut account having my intelligent finance account closed as they stopped operating. As waddo says a legal solution is best.

[waddo]

I am with TurkBank here in Girne. They also have a branch in London but when I first enquired a couple of years ago, you could not open an account there - guess what - unless you were a UK resident and have a UK address - curses! When I had a UK Bank I used the services of TurkBank London, combined with TurkBank Girne to send cash from the UK to my account in Girne. It was called Fast Cash then but still works. I am looking into sending from Revolut to TurkBank Girne, via TurkBank UK but have hit a minor problem right now. I am going to visit the English speaking guy in TurkBank on Thursday to ask questions and will let you know what happens! Let me know what response you get from TurkBank UK about non resident arrangements? Take care out there.

[Reyntj]

Ask.him who the non resident fees are for he probably wont know

[waddo]

https://www.turkishbank.co.uk/personal/ - that is interesting as it does say "Whether you are a UK resident or non-resident, you can apply to open a personal account with TurkishBank UK." If I can get a bank account in the UK with them I would be very happy!!

[munchy]

Waddo, check out the Minimum Cash Deposit they require to be lodged in TURK BANK LONDON ?

[Keithcaley]

Alphamike

probably won't be here anyway, the way things are going

.


So are you contemplating leaving this Mortal Coil, or just TRNC?

[alphamike]

Alphamike

probably won't be here anyway, the way things are going

.


So are you contemplating leaving this Mortal Coil, or just TRNC?

Well, am hoping it won't be the former....not for a good while yet anyway!

[Keithcaley]

[waddo]

Wise - After long and totally boring emails back and forth with Wise customer confusion service I have reached the point of closing my account with them. Despite many attempts to prove I live in Cyprus and that Cyprus is not actually part of or in Turkey I have given up. Wise will NOT let me open a UK account unless I can provide proof that I live in the UK so that is the end of that. If you don't live in the UK and want to open a Wise account in the UK then your only option is to lie about your residential address.

Nationwide - Still in contact with them but they are still saying that the main reason they closed my accounts was that I live overseas, they do not want to enter into any discussion on what the "Other criteria" was that I failed to meet and will not make comment on the fact that they now allow people who have an existing account with them to keep that account if they move overseas! I personally think they just had a knee jerk reaction to my change of address, made a mistake in closing our accounts and now will not admit to it and reopen the accounts again! They have at least told me that when I return to live in the UK I can open a new account with them - really???

They did come back with - "Around the start of 2022 we undertook a program to comply with new FCA regulations alongside our standard review process and it would have been decided to review overseas accounts during this period. There have been a large number of overseas accounts closed so rest assured that it is not just yours"! Another Brexit fallout I am sorry to say!

In response to further questions regarding keeping a UK account open when you have moved overseas, this because they state that on their web site, I then received this reply - "The website is correct that we allow accounts to remain open for members who move abroad. However we also reserve the right in our T’s & C’s to close accounts pending reviews, which could be down to the country of residence for example"!

Further amplification to the above was also added - "As mentioned before the reason we undertook a larger scale review was due to FCA regulations that we had to comply with, which is why the account was closed after you changing your address back in 2007" - Well it only took them 17 years to "sniff" us out in the end - lol

So duly noted and beware if you are tempted to use your correct address instead of a "Borrowed" one.

On the bright side - we still live here and are currently happy - lol. The search for a UK based bank that will allow me to open an account continues, maybe "Monza" next but will keep it to myself as I don't want to be accused of "Making too much of it" again. Hope this all has helped someone out there, it has certainly educated me in the way of banks. Take care people.

[waddo]

New information - the last lot - added out of interest!

[Laura B]

Thanks Waddo. It is very interesting and I do hope you manage to sort something out. I had a Wise account until a couple years ago which was very useful but suddenly they asked for proof of UK address which I could not do. Will keep watching how you get on. So far we have been lucky not to be kicked out of our UK bank account but I'm rather concerned that state of affairs could alter at any time. Good luck to you.

[Reyntj]

Any update on turkish.bank in uk? They didnt reply to my email. The branch nearest me is closed for renovation.

[laptawrinkly]

Hi Waddo, if the reply from Nationwide is their final reply, I would encourage you to make a complaint to the Financial Services Authority (FCA) https://www.fca.org.uk/consumers/how-complain. These banks do need to be held to account, especially when their actions are conflicting with their published policy. Also do consider a Data Subject Access Request (DSAR) about the information used in your account - unfortunately they do have a get out on releasing some information, but this can be challenged.

We were with Yorkshire Bank, which became Clydesdale, then became Virgin Money and this has now been sold to Nationwide! So we await developments. It is almost impossible to 'pretend' to live in another country and open an account there, such as the UK. I would also be concerned if you did open an account, and you tried to recover monies taken by fraud for example, if that would give the bank a get-out-of-jail card!

I think you will find that for a Cyprus (for Revolute that means the south) you will have to provide proof of address again, so may have issues there. We also looked into various 'online banks' but found some of the charges per month are enough, plus many limit the amount of ATM withdrawals as well; some even charge you extra if you use an ATM Friday PMs through to Sunday PMs!!! Why extra charges at a weekend??? So we will stay with UK bank for as long as possible.

Keep us updated as all these issues affect many

[waddo]

Laptawrinkly, The last info that I received from Nationwide meant that I would have no joy at all going to the FCA and a DSAR would only produce what they wanted it to anyway - I know that from personal experience in another life, lol - they have all of us over a barrel because we live in a country that does not exist AND it is all about what is in the small print (T&C'S) that I would have agreed to way back over 25 years ago and which have changed quite a lot since then. The big win for them is the simple statement - However we also reserve the right in our T’s & C’s to close accounts pending reviews, which could be down to the country of residence for example - as the vast majority of banks in the UK will not work with Turkey and as we are seen to be part of Turkey (or at the very least under the control of Turkey) then they will argue that in court and win against the small person every time. When I first started putting money into a bank that was the Yorkshire Penny Bank which then went through many changes in life! To get a Revolut account in Cyprus you need to have a RoC Post Code if you live in the "Occupied Territory" that is possible as the RoC still see the North as part of the RoC and have post codes for the North as well - under the Greek Names of course. The only problem then is that the pension provider would once again send your pension via Citibank London (who forward it on after converting it to the local currency of Euro's, at their rate and then applying the transfer to overseas charge as well - you still lose out no matter what you do! I am watching what Revolut are currently doing with great interest and I suspect they are going to do whatever they want regarding country of residence and address so maybe there will be a way in the end. Meanwhile I am glad we have visitors who are happy to fetch cash out for us but are still faced with the problem of where to have the pensions paid to. It is silly really but all we can do is keep banging on.