Kibkom North Cyprus Forum

We have had a rather heated debate on Kibkom a few days ago about poisoning cats/dogs and cruelty to especially dogs.
And here we have KAR with a lovely story about making sure the puppies up there are not getting sick in the hot weather.
But what is KAR doing later with the puppies?
And what is it by the way they are doing to many older dogs? They dump them.
If that is not the same cruelty, we are against, when a family is dumping a dog, then I don't know what cruelty is.

banjo

Naturally this is a very sensitive subject.

Do you have evidence to support your post? Or is it something that you may have heard...very often a long line of communication can get twisted and confused, until in the end it does not bear any resemblance to what was originally said.

Should you not consider contacting KAR direct to discuss further?

Very strong accusations are being given but no evidence to support, I would advise taking the conversation off line with KAR to establish the facts.

I know little about KAR but what I do know is that they try and do the very best for stray and unwanted animals with probably not a great deal of finance or support - unfortunately not every stray can be re-homed.

PoshinDevon wrote:banjo

Naturally this is a very sensitive subject.

Do you have evidence to support your post? Or is it something that you may have heard...very often a long line of communication can get twisted and confused, until in the end it does not bear any resemblance to what was originally said.

Should you not consider contacting KAR direct to discuss further?

Very strong accusations are being given but no evidence to support, I would advise taking the conversation off line with KAR to establish the facts.
Well said Buddy.
I know little about KAR but what I do know is that they try and do the very best for stray and unwanted animals with probably not a great deal of finance or support - unfortunately not every stray can be re-homed.

And I know Margaret Ray and many of those who work for KAR and appreciate what an enormous, almost impossible task they have, and I also know that Margaret gets very hurt by some of the tales that hit the ears (and often the media) as to what is done with animals in their care. It would be FAR FAR better to talk to her and the office before believing what one may hear. Yes, KAR does tag dogs and put them back in the street, but that is because they come from the street and KAR does not have enough room to house them. But, PLEASE take a look at their web page, or talk to them. They really DO care about their animals, they really really do, and need help and not criticism.

I agree with you Marions.
Jackie who works for KAR talked me into having a dog from there. After visiting the site thier task is near impossible and the dogs are well looked after even tho they in cages - but what else can they do.
The dog we got from KAR is so sweet and well behaved and no bad bone in her body. She gets on well with our first dog and feel that she is appreciative of the home she's got now and where she cam from. Well done KAR

I bet there are many times when Margaret wishes she had never taken in her first strays. She doesn't have endless funding, or government support, it really must seem a thankless task at times. Maybe the people that criticize should walk in her shoes for a few weeks and show her how it should be done !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

stellasstar1 wrote:...Maybe the people that criticize should walk in her shoes for a few weeks...

There's a saying: -

"Before you criticise someone, walk a mile in their shoes"

I think that it's really good advice, because then, when you start to criticise them, you're a mile away, and you've got a good head start if they come after you!

banjo wrote:We have had a rather heated debate on Kibkom a few days ago about poisoning cats/dogs and cruelty to especially dogs.
And here we have KAR with a lovely story about making sure the puppies up there are not getting sick in the hot weather.
But what is KAR doing later with the puppies?
And what is it by the way they are doing to many older dogs? They dump them.
If that is not the same cruelty, we are against, when a family is dumping a dog, then I don't know what cruelty is.

Hi -I feel I must respond to your post as I am a huge supporter of KAR and will be getting involved as a volunteer when we move over soon.
One question, have you ever been up to the shelter to see what challenges they face? I have and I can assure you they work wonders up there looking after over 200 dogs and 50 cats with more arriving daily. They run an education programme in an attempt to change some of the misconceptions around animal welfare and neutering etc. they have a capture, neuter and return policy to prevent the stray population getting any worse.
They have a finite amount of space, money & resources, so what else can they do?
Perhaps if more people volunteered to help KAR rather than crticise them, the limited money they receive could then be spent on the animals rather than human labour.
The people who work there and volunteers are dedicated to make the lives better for the strays in TRNC, they take action rather than sit on the fence and judge.
I really don't know what else you suggest they should be doing? Please feel free to make some practical suggestions bearing in mind the challenges they face?
Moyra

Hear Hear Moyra.

The dogs that they put back on the street (dump, to use banjo's emotive term) are dogs that they have picked up off the street, neutered and given any necessary medical attention - the dogs are then returned to the area that they were collected from.

This is Internationally accepted GOOD PRACTICE - if you don't believe me, just Google 'Neuter and Release', you will get over a quarter of a million results, and all National Animal Protection Agencies endorse this as a method of controlling both cat and dog feral populations.

I'm sure that KAR would just love to have the resources to home every single one of them, but they don't, so they do the best that they can.

banjo - let's see you do better.

What other option do they have? Also lots of ex pats have returned to their home land over the past couple of years and not all animals are taken with them they are often "dumped". if you take on an animal it should be for the life of the animal if there is a chance you wont be staying here dont take one on just donate money to help out.

I agree with previous posts, having two ex-KAR dogs myself. They only tag and return street dogs, otherwise they wouldn't have 200 dogs at their shelter, would they. I have enormous respect for anyone involved in the operation. We recently took what we thought was a puppy to them, which they accepted immediately even though it turned out to be a very small adult bitch which was probably pregnant.

KAR might not be perfect, but it does provide valuable services to the entire community. Being a charity is wholly dependent on the goodwill and financial support of said community.

Many TCs and other nationalities are great supporters and volunteers for this Expat founded charity.

The Annual Dog Show is brilliant, look forward to many more to come

As someone who works hard to support KAR, raise funds, using my personal money to do so on petrol, phones etc., I find it extremely hurtful and depressing to read banjos comments. Why oh why, do the people who know least, shout the loudest. The ladies in the office receive this sort of abuse many times during the course of the week, usually from people who cannot or will not accept that KAR lives from day to day, sometimes really struggling to find the money to pay their bills at the end of the month.

They do not employ illegals (as has been suggested in the past), have to maintain the vans, pay MOT, Licences, Insurance on vehicles and buildings, pay for petrol, electricity, water, refuse collection (which in the past has been very hit and miss). This is before the neuter and return programme starts, then there is the Education team, who are trying so hard to educate the next generation as to animal welfare. Unfortunately they are not invited to as many TC schools as they would like. They cannot push their way in the local schools.

And I haven't even mentioned the medical bills from local Vets, which amounts to thousands of TL every month nor the food bills. People have absolutely no idea of the cost of running KAR.

Every week people arrive with boxes full of puppies "we have found near our villa" , When asked if they would care to contribute, there is a shocked look on their faces "we haven't any money with us and in any case I sometimes put some tins iof food in your beg boxes" That's all very laudible and KAR is grateful, but that's two days food for 2 pups who can be at the centre for life if they are not homed before they grow up. One further thing, there are 300 dogs and pups at the Centre, so both animals and staff can barely keep their heads above water, but they do, each and every month as the welfare of the animals is paramount.

The KAR AGM is on September 5th at 11,30 at Dorana Hotel, Girne. If you have any complaints, come and make them face to face with KAR volunteers and committee. If not banjo, then pay up and help KAR or just shut up.