Kibkom North Cyprus Forum

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... lines.html

How, if at all, will this effect ex-pats?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-19789397 - Cached

Not very good at pasting links but this programme was put out in UK on 3/10/12

At first sight it looks good for e-pats. Just turn up and plead insanity about documents, bingo treatment we cannot get now.

Odds on it will not work like that and as one GP says, they only have finite resources so how can they effectivley be "obliged" to take new patients on to their lists.

I am sad to say the HUMAN RIGHTS card gets played and abused again.

cyprusishome wrote:At first sight it looks good for e-pats. Just turn up and plead insanity about documents, bingo treatment we cannot get now.

Odds on it will not work like that and as one GP says, they only have finite resources so how can they effectivley be "obliged" to take new patients on to their lists.

I am sad to say the HUMAN RIGHTS card gets played and abused again.

I was under the impression that GPs got more funds the more patients they had on their books. Prescriptions are not paid for by the prescribing GP.

So if I went back to the Uk for a visit after having 9 years away would I be treated or not say after going to A&E for something.

vaughan,
The GP's are already saying they are over worked with full lists. What will happen to the existing patients who already complain that they cannot get appointments, then the see all these foreigners queing up cos it is their right. This is a none starter or a scheme to drive health care into the private sector

Deniz1,
After only a short time away, certainly less than a year, you are no longer entitled to treatment under the NHS. You would be sent a bill for any treatment you do receive. We still pay UK taxes but we are not entitled to ANY NHS treatment.

Just go back to the UK and claim your human rights or perhaps they only apply to foreigners.

To qualify for the NHS in the UK you have to reside at a UK address for at least 6 months of every year even though the UK government still expect ex-pats to pay income tax.

It's a disgrace.

Do what a lot of people do,Dont tell the doctor you are leaving and stay on their books.

I haven't read the article referred to, but to anyone who takes the above advice and tries this illegal abuse of the system, I read somewhere, a while back, that hospitals are going to start checking passports.

If you paid in all your life you should get the benefit wherever you choose to live !
I am 64 and unemployed - joined RAF as apprentice at Halton before 16th birthday - did various jobs at various levels but never been unemployed til now.
Not entitled to a red cent of any kind of benefit because I have accrued £16k plus - and that was redundancy from my last job.
Where's the fairness in that system under any coloured government??
But this lot will make things a lot worse - wait and see!!!

9 years ago my doctor told me to stay registered with him so I could get treatment he knew i was going to live abroad But this has changed according to a friend recently returned to the uk. He went to see his doctor and was told he was no longer on their books as he hadnt been there for more than three months. So if you are not unwell you still have to go on a regular basis or risk being off their books.???????????

when i was in UK I went to the doctors and asked for a appointment with drX and was i told i could not have an apointment with him so i asked had he moved on? yes came the reply he died 7 yrs earlier as you can tell i did not go often so i had to mess about and register again

Hi Deniz,

That sounds potty - when I lived in the UK, there were times when I didn't visit my doctor for periods of 10 years or more...

I thought that doctors were paid according to how many patients they have 'on their books' - I'm not suggesting that any of them would actually 'cheat' , but it takes a stretch of the imagination to suppose that they would go to the effort of going through their records and checking whether patients are still living locally, just to remove ones who weren't & lose money in the process!

Has anyone 'in the biz' got an explanation?

Jeannie perhaps?

Hi Andrew, our similar posts 'crossed'

Years ago, I had almost the same experience as you - I rang to make an appointment to see 'Dr Percival', (who also happened to be an occasional customer of mine) and when I got to see the Doctor, I remarked on the fact that he'd lost a bit of weight, and was looking remarkably well.

He glanced at my notes, and said that although he recognised me as the TV repair man who used to fix his parents' telly when he was a lad, he had never treated me before - the last time I was there, I saw his Father, who had retired some years previously...

Rigsby,

You are so right.

The mistake I made was to be 100% honest so I cancelled my NHS registration.

Following a serious illness last year I returned to the UK and was not eligible for NHS treatment.

My treatment cost £12k even though I had paid tax and NI for over 40 years.

It's absolutely scandalous.

Honesty definitely doesn't pay in this instance.

Art, Worked for us. And no I do not feel guilty.Since leaving school at 14,I have only drawn the dole for 2 weeks of my working life. !963 because of the bad weather.

Like others, we were honest, although still on the GP's list, she knew we were going to live abroad. Despite paying NI for 49 years, NEVER EVER signing on, still paying UK Tax on 3 pensions (one of which is the state), my husband was thown out of the NHS last year. The Surgeon couldn't believe it, but he couldn't argue with the pen pushers. Husband was told that if he could prove that he had lived for 6 consecutive months in the UK (without leaving for so much as a weekend) then he might be able to reapply. They checked his passport, asked for receipts from ATM machines, receipts from M & S and similar stores and restaurants, plus able to prove he had paid utility bills during 6 consecutive months. I would also point out that because of work in the UK my husband came on my company benefit sceme, so he had claimed no NHS benefits for 20 years prior to moving to the TRNC. We told them that we were trying to sell our property here but they wanted to see a bill of lading to prove we were on our way back. Some hopes!!

We paid for him to have the Op. here, which has been complete dead loss, carried out by an incompetent surgeon. Nuff said.

Sophie,

So sorry to read your story which in many ways mirrors my situation and know doubt many othe ex-pats have been affected by this ludicrous,penny pinching policy.

What annoys me is that in order to qualify for the NSH we have to tell a pack of lies and this in our own country.

Like many others we have paid and continue to pay towards supporting others that are bleeding the system without ever making a financial contribution.

Where are our human rights.?

The rules for health care for "ex-pats" has been in existence for many years, just been tweaked a bit in recent years. IE if you did not know before you moved out here then you have not done your home work properly. We may think it unfair but if you choose to leave the UK for a "better life" then you are stuck with - RULES IS RULES!!!!!! You cannot have your cake and eat it.

On the other hand, we worked out the cost of having surgery here as opposed to the costs of travel to and from UK, accommodation etc which may be several times while you wait for appointments with consultant, tests, time in hospital etc. Having it done here with a superb surgeon, immediatly, and excellent aftercare, there was no comparison in total costs.

So, look at real costs of having "free" treatment with NHS if your permanent home is no longer the UK. Consider waiting times, will you see consultant or SHO, who will do treatment, Would you really enjoy being stuck on an NHS ward as opposed to a nice room etc, etc.

So, can we not go back to England for holidays and be classed as tourists and get free treatment when we need it.

Cyprusishome,

So where can you find a good surgeon in Northern Cyprus?

Perhaps its the guy who charged me around £1500 to remove my kidney stones which were still there a few weeks later and perhaps its the same guy who failed to diagnose I had a tumour on my kidney.

Not surprisingly I disagree with your confidence in the private health care in the TRNC as my experience has been to the contrary,hence the reason for going back to the UK for treatment..Thank god I did -it saved my life.

As for treatment under the NHS in the UK -giving out lectures on why we should have done our homework before moving to the TRNC does not negate the unfairness of the current system or the fact that foreigners appear through their human rights to have preference over UK citiizens even though they may have not made a financial contribution towards the cost of careing for them.

Do you believe this to be fair?

Is anything fair in this life!!????? You can have cr** surgeon in UK, USA, in fact anywhere you just have to look at on going negligence cases at any time. My wife has had two operations here with no complications, wonderful in patient care, superb follow up and did not catch MRSA which is likely in UK. Does that make health care in TRNC the best available? Of course not, the same as one bad experience does not make it the worst care. Under UK health care wife probably would never have been aware of the tumour she had because there is no "health Check" systems universally available, so thanks TRNC.

As for the UK system being fair, not for me to say. I knew that by moving here we were no longer entitled to health treatment in UK. FACT!!!! We do not vote in UK elections so have not used the right to try to change the system, did anyone who has posted here vote while living here.

In August I did the Bowel Screening test that comes through the post every two years, proved positive for blood and I had a Colonoscopy within a week, the week after I had a 90mm Polyp removed from my large bowel less than 3 weeks in all, turned out to be benign thankfully but I would not have known about it if I hadn't been sent the test to do, I had no indication of a problem at all and I felt so well.

I think this thread is going a little off-track.
As fascinating as our ailments are, the point of this thread is the NHS in the UK and ex-pats access to it, not who had what wrong with them and how they were treated.
I once had a wicked ingrowing toe-nail, but I will spare you the details.

OK vaughan got the message I was responding to the post by cyprusishome saying there are no "health checks" available.

OOOHHHH you tell tale!!!!!!!!
Nothing has change for ex pats as far as I can see. If you left UK then you knew what the rules were regarding health care ie Zilch!!!!!!

As far as the foreigners going into UK, I think the government are making a huge mistake unless they are going to find unlimited funds for the NHS to treat every waif and stray that wants it.

No life isnt fair, but the treatment of expats by the British Government must win some prizes for taking all and giving nothing. NHS treatment is just one - though perhaps an important example.
I paid taxes all my life - still pay on two pensions - never claimed any form of benefit - and topped up my NI contributions when I took early retirement. Now after l5 years I am no longer able to vote for or against MPs who can still significantly affect my life.

I agree that for most things I would prefer to pay for treatment here than have to go back and face the NHS. But what happens if one develops something (old age?) that involved regular treatment or care for life and lives alone or with partner or dependent who also needs support?

Well, my hubby broke his back a couple of years ago,in Cyprus, we paid, and thankfully, he's doing well, considering.
We spent five weeks caring for my Mum, in UK, who was poorly. At that time he developed a severe pain in his stomach.
We went to her doctor to ask for help, was asked who our doctor was?????????????
whoops...when we lived in UK, our doctor was a customer of ours, therefore he found out that we had moved to Cyprus, and
knocked ua off his books.
We said we paid our taxes and received out Uk pensions, so ended up not paying for the consultancy fee.
When we lived in UK, we paid for private health and dentistry therefore never claimed on the NHS for anything.
Now, if your postcode isn't friendly, you WILL have to pay private.
What really pees me off, is the fact that the powers that be were in nappies when I began paying my stamp, now they are telling me that I don't deserve to get treatment. Yeah righto.......

Deniz1 wrote:9 years ago my doctor told me to stay registered with him so I could get treatment he knew i was going to live abroad But this has changed according to a friend recently returned to the uk. He went to see his doctor and was told he was no longer on their books as he hadnt been there for more than three months. So if you are not unwell you still have to go on a regular basis or risk being off their books.???????????

Something not quite right Deniz1,I went to see my Doctor after not needing to see him for over 16 months,not a problem,still Registered,they cannot simply strike you off their lists without prior notification.


David

Well maybe they did try to notify him but he was in TRNC.

Maybe someone tipped them off at the surgery that he had moved to NC.

Yesterday, we had a long talk to Admin Section of Overseas Residents attached to East Anglian Health Authority. What happens now is that most patients Ops. are paid out of the Dr budget, which they then claim back from the NHS.. On top of that there would appear to be a Post Code Lottery. As the person said, EAHA are sticking strictly 110% to the present rules, HOWEVER, there are areas of the UK who are interpreting the rules more leniently, but wasn't prepared to comment further. There are huge numbers of employees in these Admin Departments who loathe having to make the decisions, such as was given to us, but they are hamstrung by their Senior Managers.

To be honest, when we came here we expected to pay for our treatment and we expected to eventually lose the right to NHS treatment as those were the rules but it irks somewhat that anyone can land in the UK from any other country in the world and claim for NHS treatment for free even though no payment has been made into the system- that's what gets up my nose!

Why oh why is there not a system whereby you can only claim after 'x' number of years of input like there apparently is in Spain?

We are still recounting history.

We all know that, as ex-pats, we weren't entitled to the NHS. Some of us paid, some of us didn't.
Some got free treatment some didn't.

What we all need to know is : What are the rules NOW??

webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/+/www.dh.gov.uk/en/... - Cached

You could always google yourself, plenty of info out on the internet, CAB Adviceguide, Directgov. etc.

Just noticed message 22. Yes, CiH I did register to vote as an overseas voter, and every year I was entitled I voted by proxy, and quite a rigmarole it was too! But after l5 years I lost myentitlement to vote, although I still seem to be able to pay taxes!


Does anyone else vote? And what do you think would happen if I tried to contact an MP since I have lost my vote?

As it does not interest me I do not know what and where but there is a web site where you can register vote as an overseas resident. I did look once several years ago and it explains what to do and about your MP. Just google electoral rights or some other combination. The fact is you are entitled to a vote.

Our MP was very good but unfortuantley died after we came out here, only young too.

Have used my mother to send letters to her MP on issues such as the North Cyprus embargos but as Mum died earlier this year no longer able to use that route. Shame really as it was William Hague.

I first registered some years ago, before the Internet was in common use and I did not even have a computer. (Incredible how quickly it has come in). There are people who still dont and life is made very difficult for them.

Sorry CiH but no-one is entitled to a vote in the UK when they have been permanently living abroad for l5 years - not even, as I tried to indicate, if they still pay UK taxes. An infringement of human rights in my view, but no-one seems to be interested.

TRNCVaughn.

The rules are quite simple as I found out last year.

You have to reside in the UK for more than 6 months of each year and you need to be registered with a UK doctor.

Qualifying for NH is not related to NI or Tax contributions its solely about UK residency.

Cheers

Art, when we spoke at great length to East Anglia Health Authority last week, we were told quite categorically that the 6 month rule had been superceded and was no longer a qualification. At least not in EAHA who were interpreting the rules as they stood, some areas are bending them just a tad.

Hi Sophie,

Forgive me if I sound a little thick and I know the qualifying rules and there interpretations vary depending on what region of the UK you need treatment but what are the rules now please?

It's really quite simple "Google" the question go on to Gov.Org or NHS web sites and look for the endless pages of on "Visitors from Overseas" and the sub-divisions in connection with Ex-pats Rights Overseas and Ex-pats Overseas over 60. However, I'm somewhat confused myself. First you state that "I know the qualifying rules" and then you say "but what are the rules now" If you are on Skype you can even phone the relevant authorities and ask them yourself.

sophie,

I believe that what Art meant was: "I know that the qualifying rules and their interpretations vary dependent on the region of the UK in which you need treatment, but what are the rules now please?

Thanks I'm just trying to establish if the rules have changed since my last medical visit in March of this year.

There is only ONE definitive answer and that is as Sophie states, go to government web site or call centre.
Asking a third party, ie on an internet forum will always lead to inaccuaracy, incrimination for wrong info and plain lies.
So Art if you want a definitive answer go to your local health authority web site or phone them cos anything else will not give you what you desire.

Forget who said it but I just love the idea of 'superb surgeons' here in the trnc.
Nice idea but interestingly when I have talkd to local doctors here about anything more serious than first aid, their advice has been 'go back to the uk' don't waste your time / money here. Think they know something that others don't.

Frankly I'd rather get a decent do-it-yourself surgery book and take it from there if I couldn't go back.

This thread has certainly generated a lot of inconsistencies regarding the NHS qualification parameters. Just to add to the mix I was resident overseas for 35 years and I am still frequently in and out of the country for varying lengths of time and have had no problems registering with more than one practitioner in different parts of the UK but I do have what seems to be the all important UK postal code around which everything seems to revolve.