Kibkom North Cyprus Forum

As per the title.

Firstly the welcome news is i am not going to post on any more threads where people are slagging the trnc off . Clearly i have a bee in my bonnet about that . I think i have made my opinion pretty clear. There have been a number of threads been hijacked by people whining on about the trnc making quite ludicrous accusations and spreading mistruths eg uk expats are being persecuted the new rules are just in place for us . There is a 100000 expats here and the trnc is screwed without us 30000 will leave....

At the end of the day the uk expat here is a small decreasing minority. Whilst many here have supported the economy historically the trnc puts its citizens first Like most other places in the world . Not wanting to dig deep into history but britain failed completely as a guarantor back in the day so the trnc owes the british little.

Most people living here and posting on the forum do so with balance and decorum . There is a handful of alf garnet victor meldrew types who post . Im going to stop interacting with them and causing unwanted tripe. Clearly I admit i am partly to blame so i apologise to the good members of the forum . To victor and alf and co before you start hijacking posts and moaning on about the trnc why dont you think about what value does it add.

I am happy here and think it is a great place to live. I find many that complain are also those that complain about immigrants in the UK.

I think things are improving here in a lot of areas and probably the only thing I think needs some serious looking at is planning control.

Weren't forums invented so that people could whinge, moan and generally generalise without any actual facts? How else do you think us old wrinklies get our fun?

As a relative newcomer here I too have been dumbfounded by the amount of people whinging about what is going on with the residency. Many, I have little doubt are the same people that voted for Brexit citing they wanted the UK to take control of their borders! Many seem to think that they have had the best of the years here and are obviously planning on retreating to Blighty or somewhere else that is cheaper, they are treated better of just anything they can think of really. Maybe some have short memories and they forget why they left the UK in the first place.

No everything here isn't perfect but the UK certainly isn't.

Reyntj wrote:
Firstly the welcome news is i am not going to post on any more threads where people are slagging the trnc off .

Anyone who has settled in the TRNC has done so because they love the country and it’s people. They may complain about aspects and rules of TRNC life because they have a stake in it as they have decided to make their life here. When they complain they do it with the view that these changes may spoil the TRNC where they have made their home.

Reyntj wrote: Whilst many here have supported the economy historically the trnc puts its citizens first Like most other places in the world . Not wanting to dig deep into history but britain failed completely as a guarantor back in the day so the trnc owes the british little.

No-one has a problem with TRNC putting it’s citizens first and no-one is anti TRNC or they wouldn’t have moved here, would they? You deflect any slight criticism of the execution of the new residency rules as anti-TRNC when your own anti-British stance is pretty clear. To my knowledge no-one who posts on here is responsible from the British governments actions a half century ago.

Reyntj wrote: At the end of the day the uk expat here is a small decreasing minority.

Yes I remember you saying that the TRNC doesn’t want or need low income retirees from England and needs cheap workers?
The main question is do the low income retirees make a positive impact on the TRNC economy? Undoubtedly yes. For sure Russian billionaire oligarchs might be better but you aren’t going to get them in a million years so it’s a moot point. As for the TRNC needing cheap workers from abroad, that sounds a great plan for a country with 20% youth unemployment.

Reyntj wrote: To victor and alf and co before you start hijacking posts and moaning on about the trnc why dont you think about what value does it add.

I responded to you criticising people with reasonable concerns about the new residency procedures with what appeared to bea pretty much go home Britis you have squeezed enough out of this country attitude.

Personally all I have done is point out that what you see as solutions, aren’t.
If endless construction that they won’t sell, universities churning out degrees from a country that has no worldwide status and big hotels that take more than they give are the long term answer for the TRNC economy then you are asking the wrong questions. Carry on down that road and the TRNC will have zero economic independence and totally rely on handouts from Turkey.

Last year my waterman said to me "Oh how I wish the british were still here running things, at least every worked and worked well then". He is in his seventies and has lived his whole life in Cyprus.

Should you look up the definition of propaganda would you not agree, having read and understood the word, that all Governments - no matter where you live or through accident or design of birth, where you were born - are the same! And that all citizens, of whatever country, are prone to complain about them? It is human nature to moan, either when you have due cause or nothing better to do. People talk to each others face to face and normally, humor is apparent from facial expression or body language. Sadly, the written word more often than not fails to capture this important part, this can be due to many things, not least of which is language and can lead to great discontent at times. The written word is harsh in the extreme, black and white with no “feeling” apparent from the majority of authors! Maybe I should return to my country of birth but as I have spent more years living outside of it around the world that I have no desire to do so. Instead, I have elected to finish my days in a country that I love, amongst people who have been born here and seen hardship here first hand. Those people, quite correctly owe the British Government and not it’s people very little at all, yet they still welcome the British people - why, I have no idea yet it is reciprocated by the British people in the UK - why?
In the end, all everyone asks for is for all Nations to be fair. I can never be a citizen of the TRNC and must forever remain a foreign visitor, this through an accident of birth in the UK - can you say the same and do you think it fair?

I may well have been guilty - in your eyes - of anti TRNC propaganda in some of my posts, or was I simply stating my personal views with which you disagree? If the latter is the case then you have my apologies for any upset I have caused you but rest assured, it was never anti TRNC but a wish to see the Nation grow and improve to take its rightful place in the World!

Chriswright03 wrote:Weren't forums invented so that people could whinge, moan and generally generalise without any actual facts? How else do you think us old wrinklies get our fun?

As a relative newcomer here I too have been dumbfounded by the amount of people whinging about what is going on with the residency. Many, I have little doubt are the same people that voted for Brexit citing they wanted the UK to take control of their borders! Many seem to think that they have had the best of the years here and are obviously planning on retreating to Blighty or somewhere else that is cheaper, they are treated better of just anything they can think of really. Maybe some have short memories and they forget why they left the UK in the first place.

No everything here isn't perfect but the UK certainly isn't.

For those of us with long memories and who may have been long in the tooth Cyprus lovers, it will never be perfect but there is a certain charm about the island. My love affair started as a teenager back in the early 70s and it has stayed with me ever since during the many years we have lived, worked and holidayed out here. Our children; now grown up, married and doing there own thing, when asked about holiday memories.....it’s always Cyprus.

We of course are biased and when asked about holidaying here in the TRNC are always cautious in what we say. We tend to think who we are replying to, what they want out of a holiday and whether they are as tolerant and like minded as ourselves. For some the TRNC is paradise, for others it’s not. We are lucky, we know where to go, places to visit, restaurants to eat out at and importantly where to avoid. This is something that takes time to discover and a short 2 week holiday is never long enough.

Living here whether all or part of the year is different and presents its own challenges, but we still love our time out here. There will always be the few that moan about changes, the infrastructure, the crazy rules and the way things are done but this is not our country. We are but guests and we would do well to remember this.

It’s been almost 50 years since I first stepped off an aircraft onto this island and it’s still as good as ever.

Im pretty sure alfs trying to rattle my cage as per my initial post im not engaging.

Reyntj wrote:Im pretty sure alfs trying to rattle my cage as per my initial post im not engaging.

I wouldn't engage either if I was you Forest.

EnjoyingTheSun wrote:

Reyntj wrote:
Firstly the welcome news is i am not going to post on any more threads where people are slagging the trnc off .

Anyone who has settled in the TRNC has done so because they love the country and it’s people. They may complain about aspects and rules of TRNC life because they have a stake in it as they have decided to make their life here. When they complain they do it with the view that these changes may spoil the TRNC where they have made their home.

Reyntj wrote: Whilst many here have supported the economy historically the trnc puts its citizens first Like most other places in the world . Not wanting to dig deep into history but britain failed completely as a guarantor back in the day so the trnc owes the british little.

No-one has a problem with TRNC putting it’s citizens first and no-one is anti TRNC or they wouldn’t have moved here, would they? You deflect any slight criticism of the execution of the new residency rules as anti-TRNC when your own anti-British stance is pretty clear. To my knowledge no-one who posts on here is responsible from the British governments actions a half century ago.

Reyntj wrote: At the end of the day the uk expat here is a small decreasing minority.

Yes I remember you saying that the TRNC doesn’t want or need low income retirees from England and needs cheap workers?
The main question is do the low income retirees make a positive impact on the TRNC economy? Undoubtedly yes. For sure Russian billionaire oligarchs might be better but you aren’t going to get them in a million years so it’s a moot point. As for the TRNC needing cheap workers from abroad, that sounds a great plan for a country with 20% youth unemployment.

Reyntj wrote: To victor and alf and co before you start hijacking posts and moaning on about the trnc why dont you think about what value does it add.

I responded to you criticising people with reasonable concerns about the new residency procedures with what appeared to bea pretty much go home Britis you have squeezed enough out of this country attitude.

Personally all I have done is point out that what you see as solutions, aren’t.
If endless construction that they won’t sell, universities churning out degrees from a country that has no worldwide status and big hotels that take more than they give are the long term answer for the TRNC economy then you are asking the wrong questions. Carry on down that road and the TRNC will have zero economic independence and totally rely on handouts from Turkey.

I could not agree more - particularly your first paragraph. Constructive criticism of policies which impact loyal and supportive residents, and particularly the vulnerable, should not be dismissed as "moaning".

Your last paragraph strikes cords not only with long-standing permanent residents but with many Cypriots who are concerned about current "developments (figurative and actual ) which are marring the face of this beautiful country land seriously damaging our quality of life.

The insecurities engendered by the new residence regulations are simply the last straw that starts one thinking of pulling up deep roots and returning to a native country that is no longer home.

Anyone who has researched the hoops retu rning long term elderly expats have to go through to restablish themselves into the system from Banking to Social Services and NHS will realise that returning to the UK it s not escaping or retreating but a policy of desperation,

there are some characters on here who want to row about every last thing thing I write . Once they lose an argument they just move onto something else unrelated . Sure there is constructive criticism but thats not what i have been replying to . There have been absolute damn lies written .

An example of this is a recent thread where someone wrote they wanted advice about extending their visa for a forthcoming hotel visit. The first reply made no attempt to help or add value just moaned on about the trnc debacle and how there was dwindling non existant tourists. So I interjected with evidence that actual tourists where going up . Then the guy who wants to argue with every single word i write popped up and inferred i was wrong and posted a link to some other data. But he had not read it properly and it also confirmed tourist rates where going up. When i pointed this out he just started making up arguments that had no relevance about hotel capacity universities construction etc . They had no relevance to the thread topic they had no relevance to my rebuke of dwindling tourists. This guy just did not like to look a fool and lose an argument so starts bleating on about other things throwing the thread into tripe. Some of his views may have merit but have nothing to do with the threads. Hence my post today . Nothing to do with constructive criticism . Hijacking a thread in the second post and making negative stuff up about the trnc is not constructive criticism is it . Defending the trnc has been like been a liverpool supporter in a man united forum . you might think well thats fine but there are not many united fans living in toxteth are there.....

Reyntj wrote:there are some characters on here who want to row about every last thing thing I write . Once they lose an argument they just move onto something else unrelated . Sure there is constructive criticism but thats not what i have been replying to . There have been absolute damn lies written .

An example of this is a recent thread where someone wrote they wanted advice about extending their visa for a forthcoming hotel visit. The first reply made no attempt to help or add value just moaned on about the trnc debacle and how there was dwindling non existant tourists. So I interjected with evidence that actual tourists where going up . Then the guy who wants to argue with every single word i write popped up and inferred i was wrong and posted a link to some other data. But he had not read it properly and it also confirmed tourist rates where going up. When i pointed this out he just started making up arguments that had no relevance about hotel capacity universities construction etc .

Any government statistics are sliced and diced to suit whatever narrative they want to tell.
I generally take all UK government figures with a large pinch of salt so there is no bias here. That said I especially wouldn’t trust the figures from a government whose best guess on their population seems to be that it is somewhere between 280,000 and 500,000+.
So with tourist numbers, a big question is how do we measure them?
Visitors who cross the borders, which will also capture the GC cab drivers in Nicosia who cross the border to fill up?
People flying in and out of Ercan? So if I fly to the UK and back twice in a year then I am 2 tourists?
If someone came for a 28 day visit in 2018 but has come for 2 x 14 day visits in 2019, is that measured the same, double or what?
So capturing these figures at the airports and border isn’t ideal.
Most people I speak to who are in the hotel business, both big and small operators, are stating tourism has dropped over the last few years. Dittto restaurants and bars. But obviously that is anecdotal evidence which isn’t acceptable so I included a link which gives pretty mixed messages but has the following statistic;
“According to Turkish Cypriot daily ‘Diyalog’, statistics show that hotels in 2017 were fill to 58.5% capacity, while in 2018 that number had decreased to 51.3%. In hotels with casino these numbers were 62% for 2017 and 54% in 2018. Commenting on these figures, Caginer stated that in 2019 the situation seems to be similar to 2018.”
Now some people can read between the lines but for your benefit let me elaborate.
If hotel capacity is dropping you can rest assured that is a pretty good indicator that tourism is dropping. That said you don’t strike me as the sharpest knife in the drawer so maybe ask someone to spell it out.
I only pick up on what you say when you speak bollox, unfortunately for the most part it is anti British bitter nonsense which makes no logical sense. EG we don’t need low income retirees we need low paid workers. So when you say how booming construction and the universities are doing, I simply point out that these booms are built on sand. I am chopping down your go home Brits attitude.

You might consider me not sharp but I am a self made millionaire who retired to trnc at the age of 42 . Whilst i have plenty of time on my hands I have better things to do than spending time arguing never endingly wth you

Regarding your hotel capacity you havent even considered that there are a new hotels opening? Clearly its a very simple equation isnt it that as more hotels open even though more tourists are coming that the increase in the number of hotels may well lead to a decreased percentage capacity .But then you will just ignore this relevant fact you hate to be proven wrong . Even though hotel capacity was not anything to do with the orgiginal post . Try to use your noddle before making a fool out yourself. Limak hotel concorde hotel elexus etc a all big capacity hotels . Probably daily capacity 3000+plus times that out buy a year might help explain .....if someone of my low forest gump level intelligence has to point that out to you im not sure where that puts you on the ladder


I find some of your language inappropriate but that is no doubt an indication of your class.

Goodbye

P.s. salamis hotel increased its capacity by 200 rooms last year . 400 guests per day ....

Dear me I thought he holds a UK passport so British (hee-hee) and a self made millionaire
But the missus has to go out to work

Yes my wife works she just turned 4o she was going to stop in september but is now planning to stop next june .. i have no idea what my british passport or my wifes choice of working has to do with anything .

Is pointing out apparent discrepancies between the attitudes to immigration of some UK citizen immigrants in North re the rules the TRNC is putting place and those they would like to see in place in the UK, anti British ?

How many of those British immigrants in the TRNC that consider these new policies in the TRNC unfair and unnecessarily burdensome would be happy to see such polices introduced in the UK at all let alone consider such unfair to those seeking to live in the UK who were not UK nationals ? Anyone can come and have the right to reside in the UK so long as they own a property in the UK and can show income of minimum wage ? Anyone can come and have the right to reside in the UK if they rent a property there and can show income of three times the minimum wage ? Would they vote for a political party in the UK that was proposing such an immigration policy for the UK ?

There is also this idea that a UK national, with assets and income, coming to reside in the TRNC is more economically beneficial to the TRNC than say a TRNC national without assets and income going to the UK is economically beneficial to the UK. Things are just not as simple as they seem. My father went to the UK from Cyprus in 1960 with no assets and no income. He went there to work and to provide a better life for himself and his family, meaning me and my brother. Some 40 odd years later I went from the UK to Cyprus with assets and income. I came seeking a better life for myself by not having to work or work as much as I had to in the UK. My father was more economically beneficial to the UK than I am to the TRNC. Not just a bit more beneficial but vastly more beneficial. Orders of magnitude more beneficial.

Its the lies being posted i dont like . Eg toursit numbers aren non existant and dwindling then moan moan

Theres one statistical genius amongst us who according to himself represents the expats who claimed there are 100000 permanent expats living here and 30000 will now leave beacuse of a bit of paperwork .im fed up repyling to all this nonsense hence my initial post . Thre are some valid points and concerns but they are been marred by a few who compare the trnc to a sinking titanic . If they want to be the first on the life boat be my guest

For those very few that it applies to, please keep on topic and debate sensibly. Deliberately posting in order to seek a negative reaction from a particular member doesn’t help the discussion.

There is nothing wrong with disagreeing with another poster, however if the topic just descends into a tit for tat points scoring slanging match then it’s better that you continue off the board via email or pm.

Having to lock topics or delete posts is only done as a last resort, but it’s had to be done recently and will be done again if required.

Im too busy to post any more as im setting up a new business here . In the uk you have pay day loans.
Im setting up visa day loans apparently there is an urgent requirement.......

Reyntj wrote:You might consider me not sharp but I am a self made millionaire who retired to trnc at the age of 42 .

1/ Money is no indicator of brains
2/ I’m assuming you are a millionaire in Thai Bahts

Reyntj wrote: Regarding your hotel capacity you havent even considered that there are a new hotels opening? Clearly its a very simple equation isnt it that as more hotels open even though more tourists are coming that the increase in the number of hotels may well lead to a decreased percentage capacity .

That kind of touches on the construction industry and the general business acumen out here. You are running a hotel on a capacity in the mid 50%s against a world-wide average of around 67%. Answer, build another hotel or more floors on your half empty hotel. You should take your self made millionaire business acumen and advise the government. You are certainly reading off the same hymn sheet.
Anyhow talk me through the disconnect between needing low paid workers and 20% youth unemployment.

Reyntj wrote: marred by a few who compare the trnc to a sinking titanic .

The TRNC economy is not doing particularly well or is anywhere near self sufficient. Much of that isn’t it’s fault but it’s policies at the moment won’t help.

Reyntj wrote:Im too busy to post any more as im setting up a new business here . In the uk you have pay day loans.
Im setting up visa day loans apparently there is an urgent requirement.......

If that’s aimed at me don’t worry yourself old son I’m fine. If it’s a dig at the poor souls who are going to struggle to remain even though they can support themselves and are contributor to the TRNC economy then you are showing your class

PoshinDevon wrote:For those very few that it applies to, please keep on topic and debate sensibly. Deliberately posting in order to seek a negative reaction from a particular member doesn’t help the discussion.

There is nothing wrong with disagreeing with another poster, however if the topic just descends into a tit for tat points scoring slanging match then it’s better that you continue off the board via email or pm.

Having to lock topics or delete posts is only done as a last resort, but it’s had to be done recently and will be done again if required.

Being one of those 'naughty boys' whose post was deleted for my vehement disagreement with an anti-Brit, post changing and most nosy parker regarding others private taxation business, I fully support the right of MODs to delete or edit posts on this forum. However, your interpretation of an argument is at variance with mine. No doubt your MOD colleagues will have support for your view, rather than mine. So, I'll leave it there before I am banned!