New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Sun 27 Dec 2020 10:29 pm
A new Trade deal between Turkey and the UK is imminent. That surely is good news post Brexit and hopefully this step may lead to Other positive developments.
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New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
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Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Mon 28 Dec 2020 7:08 am
The Gov are putting a lot of positive spin on new trade deals, but actually they are mainly just a replication of the previous deal they had via the EU, so in effect nothing new. Hopefully as you say any deal with Turkey may lead to other positives.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Mon 28 Dec 2020 8:24 am
As every trade deal we had via the EU was apparently the greatest trade deal anyone could possibly ever dream of then if this deal is a replication then that's good, no?
I'm surprised because I thought that we were going to be taken advantage of now we weren't in the EU?
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Tue 29 Dec 2020 11:27 am
surprise surprise.... 
wth the UK wants to write into a new trade agreement with turkey which gives the UK a significant advantage to the old EU contracts?
that the UK now accepts oranges treated with unknown chemicals instead of the "inflated" spanish ones, but for 1 penny each less?
wth the UK wants to write into a new trade agreement with turkey which gives the UK a significant advantage to the old EU contracts?
that the UK now accepts oranges treated with unknown chemicals instead of the "inflated" spanish ones, but for 1 penny each less?
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Tue 29 Dec 2020 11:46 am
kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑Tue 29 Dec 2020 11:27 amsurprise surprise....
wth the UK wants to write into a new trade agreement with turkey which gives the UK a significant advantage to the old EU contracts?
that the UK now accepts oranges treated with unknown chemicals instead of the "inflated" spanish ones, but for 1 penny each less?
Obviously we should all be encouraged if negotiators can agree and improve on trade deals.
Do you have a source for the unknown chemicals text?
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Tue 29 Dec 2020 1:54 pm
Well if its Turkey, they already export oranges to the EU, so unless we specifically ask for unknown chemicals to be added I would expect that they would be sending us the same oranges they export to the EU that have passed EU regulations. The 1 penny saving will be the lack of tariffs that the EU puts on to non EU oranges to protect the producers in Spain.kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑Tue 29 Dec 2020 11:27 amsurprise surprise....
wth the UK wants to write into a new trade agreement with turkey which gives the UK a significant advantage to the old EU contracts?
that the UK now accepts oranges treated with unknown chemicals instead of the "inflated" spanish ones, but for 1 penny each less?
The Eu protects its own members suppliers with regulations as well as tariffs.
Who knows maybe the xenophobic UK will strike mutually beneficial trade agreements with countries in the third world who could do with the trade and save a few quid at the same time, wouldn't that be horrendous?
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Tue 29 Dec 2020 3:54 pm
you would expect a lot.. but would they do it?
so, you have to set up a lot of control things as well... which does cost a fortune.
in germany we also have people who support a "Dexit".
problem is.. with the membership in the EU, germany earns/saves direct and indirect 30 - 40 billion euros a year.
(it is more or less the same with the UK, maybe 25-35)
asked how these monies should "come in" after a dexit, the answers are .... basically non existent. definitely not with a bilateral fish agreement with the UK and also not with oranges.
from that 30-40bn , we can deduct the 10 bn net contribution to the EU, which (in parts) makes sure that in 20 years we have members which can buy expensive german stuff. that trade more or less smoothly can go on.
but this you do not want to see. the UK people (52%) want the EUonly to pay for the "poorer " EU countries and prefer maximum money skimming.
the EU criticized exactly that "cherry picking". not only since Brexit.
always it was said that the EU is a "monster".. but the EU are countries, regions, people.
it is not UK "vs" EU and "two equal partners" have to find an agreement.
it is UK vs germany/france/italy/poland/hungary/spain/portugal/cyprus....... and they all have say.
that, you, the UK, it seems, somehow can not accept that in this "rally" it is 65 vs 445 million PEOPLE.
the new trade deal with Turkiye will bring you nothing, except higher costs. the 1 penny savings will go for new tax and customs control easily.
and if, eg, the car items imported from Turkiye are not EU standart you can not export cars (and not tax free) from UK to EU.
so what?
the same destiny will happen many times in the future.
so, you have to set up a lot of control things as well... which does cost a fortune.
in germany we also have people who support a "Dexit".
problem is.. with the membership in the EU, germany earns/saves direct and indirect 30 - 40 billion euros a year.
(it is more or less the same with the UK, maybe 25-35)
asked how these monies should "come in" after a dexit, the answers are .... basically non existent. definitely not with a bilateral fish agreement with the UK and also not with oranges.
from that 30-40bn , we can deduct the 10 bn net contribution to the EU, which (in parts) makes sure that in 20 years we have members which can buy expensive german stuff. that trade more or less smoothly can go on.
but this you do not want to see. the UK people (52%) want the EUonly to pay for the "poorer " EU countries and prefer maximum money skimming.
the EU criticized exactly that "cherry picking". not only since Brexit.
always it was said that the EU is a "monster".. but the EU are countries, regions, people.
it is not UK "vs" EU and "two equal partners" have to find an agreement.
it is UK vs germany/france/italy/poland/hungary/spain/portugal/cyprus....... and they all have say.
that, you, the UK, it seems, somehow can not accept that in this "rally" it is 65 vs 445 million PEOPLE.
the new trade deal with Turkiye will bring you nothing, except higher costs. the 1 penny savings will go for new tax and customs control easily.
and if, eg, the car items imported from Turkiye are not EU standart you can not export cars (and not tax free) from UK to EU.
so what?
the same destiny will happen many times in the future.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Tue 29 Dec 2020 4:02 pm
Turkey should make any deal conditional on recognition of the TRNC!
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Tue 29 Dec 2020 4:22 pm
So you are not British? So with all due respect what Britain votes for and how the people decide their future isn't anything to do with you is it?
But I do have a question, as a German, given that a significant majority of the German people were against the Euro, how do you feel about being taken into it without a vote?
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Wed 30 Dec 2020 2:07 pm
no, iam not british.
you, the british, can vote for whatever you like.. but indeed this decision has something to do with me.
me, is one of the 445 million people of the EU who had to accept the decision of the legally elected representatives of the EU member states to accept the UK as a new EU member many years ago.
from you i only can hear "we joined", "we left".... (and "we" have given india independency... )
you, the UK, has been invited by the people of the EU to join a community!
if WE would have had a possibility to vote pro or con UK (in a referendum) ... believe me, this would have been close.
... and latest after Thatchers " i want my money back" the uk would have been chucked out by the people of the EU immediately.
so, sometimes it is wiser not to ask the public and wiser to trust in the decisions of the reps (which, of course, should show some sort of "consistency" in their believe and not change every 3 month pro and con EU..) .
me, one of the 445 million people of the EU, insisted that Mr Barnier pls get us a better deal as the UK in their cherry picking behavior offered us. i only hear "we (do not) want that and that" .. as the world would circle around the UK only.
believe me, there is an alliance of eg, Dexit (and other XXexiteers, but not neccessarily uk friendly ) and EU supporters, which numbers most probably account in total to more as the 52% brexit supporters in britain , which want the UK out (not me) with the hardest of a hard brexit. you want to stay alone? stay alone.
close the tunnel, finish, stay at home and eat your fish yourself, thats it. we can manage with potatoes and pasta, its healthier anyway.
this is short sighted, of course, but this is a very popular emotional (and at the end often revised) opinion.
and why?, because it seems you do not care about the people in the EU. it seems you have no clue what it means for the people of the EU that 50 years ago you have been invited to join "our community" and now you leave.
that "we" need a visa, even if it is "given" (thank you... ) for 90 days automatically, is a massive "mind cracker" for many people in the EU of all nationalities. incl, eg, the cypriots incl the TCs (with EU- Roc passports).
brexit.. your selfishness... many of the "we", the people of the EU, take it personally.
"your" reputation is somewhat similar as of Donald Trump. britain first.
ok then. many less will visit the uk in the future. ok, one chance would be the GBP devaluates by another 25%, but that would mean also millions less UK tourists EU/worldwide and much less people come to work in the UK.
And as the EU will continue to support poorer EU countries, for greece it will be easy to accept tourists from other EU countries instead and germany needs nurses as well.
the euro was a "change with announcement" it took, from eua to ecu (britain joined) to euro (britain did not join), what?, 30+ years?
all parties announced their "will for the euro" (or not) in many elections...
so, the change at the end was no surprise and actually the "will of the (german) people", which did not really needed a referendum.
for what, my goodness?, money is money and the advantages of one currency (and one market) was explained 30 long years .
now you lost your "main enemy", the EU, actually: the people of the EU. the one(s) you blamed for any s*** happened in your country.
thats over.
you, the british, can vote for whatever you like.. but indeed this decision has something to do with me.
me, is one of the 445 million people of the EU who had to accept the decision of the legally elected representatives of the EU member states to accept the UK as a new EU member many years ago.
from you i only can hear "we joined", "we left".... (and "we" have given india independency... )
you, the UK, has been invited by the people of the EU to join a community!
if WE would have had a possibility to vote pro or con UK (in a referendum) ... believe me, this would have been close.
... and latest after Thatchers " i want my money back" the uk would have been chucked out by the people of the EU immediately.
so, sometimes it is wiser not to ask the public and wiser to trust in the decisions of the reps (which, of course, should show some sort of "consistency" in their believe and not change every 3 month pro and con EU..) .
me, one of the 445 million people of the EU, insisted that Mr Barnier pls get us a better deal as the UK in their cherry picking behavior offered us. i only hear "we (do not) want that and that" .. as the world would circle around the UK only.
believe me, there is an alliance of eg, Dexit (and other XXexiteers, but not neccessarily uk friendly ) and EU supporters, which numbers most probably account in total to more as the 52% brexit supporters in britain , which want the UK out (not me) with the hardest of a hard brexit. you want to stay alone? stay alone.
close the tunnel, finish, stay at home and eat your fish yourself, thats it. we can manage with potatoes and pasta, its healthier anyway.
this is short sighted, of course, but this is a very popular emotional (and at the end often revised) opinion.
and why?, because it seems you do not care about the people in the EU. it seems you have no clue what it means for the people of the EU that 50 years ago you have been invited to join "our community" and now you leave.
that "we" need a visa, even if it is "given" (thank you... ) for 90 days automatically, is a massive "mind cracker" for many people in the EU of all nationalities. incl, eg, the cypriots incl the TCs (with EU- Roc passports).
brexit.. your selfishness... many of the "we", the people of the EU, take it personally.
"your" reputation is somewhat similar as of Donald Trump. britain first.
ok then. many less will visit the uk in the future. ok, one chance would be the GBP devaluates by another 25%, but that would mean also millions less UK tourists EU/worldwide and much less people come to work in the UK.
And as the EU will continue to support poorer EU countries, for greece it will be easy to accept tourists from other EU countries instead and germany needs nurses as well.
the euro was a "change with announcement" it took, from eua to ecu (britain joined) to euro (britain did not join), what?, 30+ years?
all parties announced their "will for the euro" (or not) in many elections...
so, the change at the end was no surprise and actually the "will of the (german) people", which did not really needed a referendum.
for what, my goodness?, money is money and the advantages of one currency (and one market) was explained 30 long years .
now you lost your "main enemy", the EU, actually: the people of the EU. the one(s) you blamed for any s*** happened in your country.
thats over.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Wed 30 Dec 2020 2:43 pm
Very interesting to hear an opinion from someone who maybe sees the downside for the EU of UK leaving.... I think the big question is.... why exactly did UK want to leave the club....... I am sure there are many aspects to consider. Maybe, just maybe, people felt it is time to 'put Britain first', who knows? It really is not just about fish.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Wed 30 Dec 2020 3:09 pm
Well a total rewriting of history there Kibsolar, there were so many highlights but my particular favourite being the Euro was the will of the German people but then your views on democracy aren't the same as mine but then that may be cultural differences I suppose.
Government has a large role to play in people's lives but I am fundamentally in favour of small government as opposed to big government as I do not want every aspect of my life to be micro managed. People should have the right to make choices even if they are bad choices.
I wish the people of Europe no ill will and if the EU improves and works for the people who are tied to it then good luck to them but, right or wrong I voted for what I thought was best for the British people as I have 'skin in the game.'
Your interest is Germany and I assume you wouldn't be in favour of the EU project if you felt it was harmful to Germany unless of course you are one of those who put dogma over country, family etc.
Government has a large role to play in people's lives but I am fundamentally in favour of small government as opposed to big government as I do not want every aspect of my life to be micro managed. People should have the right to make choices even if they are bad choices.
I wish the people of Europe no ill will and if the EU improves and works for the people who are tied to it then good luck to them but, right or wrong I voted for what I thought was best for the British people as I have 'skin in the game.'
Your interest is Germany and I assume you wouldn't be in favour of the EU project if you felt it was harmful to Germany unless of course you are one of those who put dogma over country, family etc.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Wed 30 Dec 2020 5:02 pm
The trade deal with Turkey is indeed some good news. In effect nothing changes as Turkey has ben in a trade agreement with the EU and UK for many years.
What will be an issue is the exchange rate platform. Turkish suppliers take upon the Euros and or £sterling must be considered . The inter trading currency within Turkey has been the Euro for many years. It is unlikely that sterling will command a stronger position that the established Euro.
If the UK is forced or asked to trade in Euros then there will be significant obstacles and costs to facilitate a free flow of trade.
The general EU "Deal" leaves only 4 years further transition before a re assessment. This is NOT a good position for the UK as yet again prolonged uncertainly effects confidence and investment. 4 years is a mere blink in business terms and indeed fishing is also left in a limbo "wait and see" position.
Many industries will be weary of making important investment decisions whilst the state of the tide remains yet again uncertain.
As I have said. I envisage several possibly many years of doldrum sailing before any positives may emerge. In the interim the loss to the current and effected generation will be testing and challenging.
What will be an issue is the exchange rate platform. Turkish suppliers take upon the Euros and or £sterling must be considered . The inter trading currency within Turkey has been the Euro for many years. It is unlikely that sterling will command a stronger position that the established Euro.
If the UK is forced or asked to trade in Euros then there will be significant obstacles and costs to facilitate a free flow of trade.
The general EU "Deal" leaves only 4 years further transition before a re assessment. This is NOT a good position for the UK as yet again prolonged uncertainly effects confidence and investment. 4 years is a mere blink in business terms and indeed fishing is also left in a limbo "wait and see" position.
Many industries will be weary of making important investment decisions whilst the state of the tide remains yet again uncertain.
As I have said. I envisage several possibly many years of doldrum sailing before any positives may emerge. In the interim the loss to the current and effected generation will be testing and challenging.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Wed 30 Dec 2020 5:45 pm
The EU has completed a trade deal with china. The spend is in the region of 1 billion US$ per day. Whilst china is a very protectionist economy it is certainly a threat to UK trade as the UK must now compete against EU suppliers in this very important market.
The NEW UK protectionist policy will not sit well with China regardless of their double standards. China has the wealth and might to carry such strategies.
The NEW UK protectionist policy will not sit well with China regardless of their double standards. China has the wealth and might to carry such strategies.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Wed 30 Dec 2020 6:19 pm
http://www.worldstopexports.com/turkeys ... -partners/waz-24-7 wrote: ↑Wed 30 Dec 2020 5:02 pm
What will be an issue is the exchange rate platform. Turkish suppliers take upon the Euros and or £sterling must be considered . The inter trading currency within Turkey has been the Euro for many years. It is unlikely that sterling will command a stronger position that the established Euro.
If the UK is forced or asked to trade in Euros then there will be significant obstacles and costs to facilitate a free flow of trade.
.
Germany: US$15.4 billion (9% of total Turkish exports)
United Kingdom: $10.9 billion (6.3%)
Italy: $9.3 billion (5.4%)
Iraq: $9 billion (5.2%)
United States: $8 billion (4.7%)
These are the top 5 countries it exports to, America is fifth and the U.K. is second.
Does Turkey trade with the USA in Euros?
I‘d be very surprised if they do.
Your guess and it is a guess is your usual pessimistic nonsense
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Wed 30 Dec 2020 6:28 pm
China runs a trade surplus of over £18 billion with the U.K. We might not be their biggest customer but we are a good one. China will always try to throw their weight around, they try it with America so I doubt they won’t with even the all mighty EU but they have to export as they don’t have enough domestic demand to sustain their model.waz-24-7 wrote: ↑Wed 30 Dec 2020 5:45 pmThe EU has completed a trade deal with china. The spend is in the region of 1 billion US$ per day. Whilst china is a very protectionist economy it is certainly a threat to UK trade as the UK must now compete against EU suppliers in this very important market.
The NEW UK protectionist policy will not sit well with China regardless of their double standards. China has the wealth and might to carry such strategies.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Wed 30 Dec 2020 7:02 pm
That is correct and I agree to an extent.EnjoyingTheSun wrote: ↑Wed 30 Dec 2020 6:28 pmChina runs a trade surplus of over £18 billion with the U.K. We might not be their biggest customer but we are a good one. China will always try to throw their weight around, they try it with America so I doubt they won’t with even the all mighty EU but they have to export as they don’t have enough domestic demand to sustain their model.waz-24-7 wrote: ↑Wed 30 Dec 2020 5:45 pmThe EU has completed a trade deal with china. The spend is in the region of 1 billion US$ per day. Whilst china is a very protectionist economy it is certainly a threat to UK trade as the UK must now compete against EU suppliers in this very important market.
The NEW UK protectionist policy will not sit well with China regardless of their double standards. China has the wealth and might to carry such strategies.
The NEW position that the UK enters the global trade platform does not suggest what may change. It would be both foolish and very presumptive to take for granted anything that is current and outside current trading terms.
Of course the UK remains an important CUSTOMER to china. Its very easy to be a customer. To sell to a customer is far more challenging and competitive. The EU has just increased its advantage over the UK
The UK must earn offshore dollars to maintain any level of welfare and prosperity. This is the task before the economy right now.
I feel the EU exit strategy has not accounted sufficiently for this essential process. That is why I see some difficult times ahead.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Wed 30 Dec 2020 8:06 pm
Some 66 countries have signed up to deals with the UK already and they run into billions. So whether anyone likes it or not the difficult times are likely to be short lived. Oh and in case there is doubt the number of deals was spoken about by a UK government minister this morning live on UK TV.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Wed 30 Dec 2020 8:59 pm
Thanks for your optimism.Telstar wrote: ↑Wed 30 Dec 2020 8:06 pmSome 66 countries have signed up to deals with the UK already and they run into billions. So whether anyone likes it or not the difficult times are likely to be short lived. Oh and in case there is doubt the number of deals was spoken about by a UK government minister this morning live on UK TV.
I only hope you are right. Somehow however, from the front line . Trade deals are one thing. Getting the orders and getting dollars into the UK economy is not a short lived task. It can take a long time and is definitely a slow process.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Thu 31 Dec 2020 12:13 am
kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑Wed 30 Dec 2020 2:07 pmno, iam not british.
you, the british, can vote for whatever you like.. but indeed this decision has something to do with me.
me, is one of the 445 million people of the EU who had to accept the decision of the legally elected representatives of the EU member states to accept the UK as a new EU member many years ago.
from you i only can hear "we joined", "we left".... (and "we" have given india independency... )
you, the UK, has been invited by the people of the EU to join a community!
if WE would have had a possibility to vote pro or con UK (in a referendum) ... believe me, this would have been close.
... and latest after Thatchers " i want my money back" the uk would have been chucked out by the people of the EU immediately.
so, sometimes it is wiser not to ask the public and wiser to trust in the decisions of the reps (which, of course, should show some sort of "consistency" in their believe and not change every 3 month pro and con EU..) .
me, one of the 445 million people of the EU, insisted that Mr Barnier pls get us a better deal as the UK in their cherry picking behavior offered us. i only hear "we (do not) want that and that" .. as the world would circle around the UK only.
believe me, there is an alliance of eg, Dexit (and other XXexiteers, but not neccessarily uk friendly ) and EU supporters, which numbers most probably account in total to more as the 52% brexit supporters in britain , which want the UK out (not me) with the hardest of a hard brexit. you want to stay alone? stay alone.
close the tunnel, finish, stay at home and eat your fish yourself, thats it. we can manage with potatoes and pasta, its healthier anyway.
this is short sighted, of course, but this is a very popular emotional (and at the end often revised) opinion.
and why?, because it seems you do not care about the people in the EU. it seems you have no clue what it means for the people of the EU that 50 years ago you have been invited to join "our community" and now you leave.
that "we" need a visa, even if it is "given" (thank you... ) for 90 days automatically, is a massive "mind cracker" for many people in the EU of all nationalities. incl, eg, the cypriots incl the TCs (with EU- Roc passports).
brexit.. your selfishness... many of the "we", the people of the EU, take it personally.
"your" reputation is somewhat similar as of Donald Trump. britain first.
ok then. many less will visit the uk in the future. ok, one chance would be the GBP devaluates by another 25%, but that would mean also millions less UK tourists EU/worldwide and much less people come to work in the UK.
And as the EU will continue to support poorer EU countries, for greece it will be easy to accept tourists from other EU countries instead and germany needs nurses as well.
the euro was a "change with announcement" it took, from eua to ecu (britain joined) to euro (britain did not join), what?, 30+ years?
all parties announced their "will for the euro" (or not) in many elections...
so, the change at the end was no surprise and actually the "will of the (german) people", which did not really needed a referendum.
for what, my goodness?, money is money and the advantages of one currency (and one market) was explained 30 long years .
now you lost your "main enemy", the EU, actually: the people of the EU. the one(s) you blamed for any s*** happened in your country.
thats over.
Bye
https://twitter.com/BurnsideNotTosh/sta ... 95616?s=20
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Thu 31 Dec 2020 11:22 am
So we are now earning offshore dollars now, not euros?waz-24-7 wrote: ↑Wed 30 Dec 2020 7:02 pm
The UK must earn offshore dollars to maintain any level of welfare and prosperity. This is the task before the economy right now.
I feel the EU exit strategy has not accounted sufficiently for this essential process. That is why I see some difficult times ahead.
You admit that you made up that bit about Turkey wanting us to trade in Euros? Not logical is it? Bit more project fear eh?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_t ... ed_Kingdom
Yes Britain should strive to cut its deficit in its Balance of Payments. That said joining the EEC didn't help in that.
The British people like their exports. This is an important fact for those who believe in printing money to stimulate the economy. Yes more money swishes around the economy which causes inflation and most of it gets spent on exports so our Balance of Payments goes more into deficit and we have effectively stimulated other countries economies.
We currently run a surplus with non EU countries as a whole and a deficit with EU countries.
Our biggest deficit is with the Germans which may account for their keenness to strike a deal. Germany is keen on the EU because they need a ready made market for their exports.
Our trade with France is about SP which will no doubt account for their intransigence.
We will now be free to strike our own deals which can only be a good thing. The size of the EU is an advantage but size can also be a disadvantage. Elephants can't run particularly fast or change direction quickly.
I can't see our trade with India being roughly the same as with Poland for long and this is where our eyes should be directed not just to the EU.
We are no longer locked in Sainsbury's because they give away Green Shield Stamps. We can now see if Tesco has improved and look at other shops that we haven't even tried yet.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Thu 31 Dec 2020 12:18 pm
We will now be free to strike our own deals which can only be a good thing. The size of the EU is an advantage but size can also be a disadvantage. Elephants can't run particularly fast or change direction quickly.
I can't see our trade with India being roughly the same as with Poland for long and this is where our eyes should be directed not just to the EU.
We are no longer locked in Sainsbury's because they give away Green Shield Stamps. We can now see if Tesco has improved and look at other shops that we haven't even tried yet.
[/quote]
Exactly!
We have a tariff free deal with the EU whilst at the same time we are able to strike trade deals on mutually agreeable terms with the remainder of the world. A good number of small and larger deals have already been agreed. Yes we will need more and yes some may take longer to achieve, but there is a world of opportunity out there.
I can't see our trade with India being roughly the same as with Poland for long and this is where our eyes should be directed not just to the EU.
We are no longer locked in Sainsbury's because they give away Green Shield Stamps. We can now see if Tesco has improved and look at other shops that we haven't even tried yet.
[/quote]
Exactly!
We have a tariff free deal with the EU whilst at the same time we are able to strike trade deals on mutually agreeable terms with the remainder of the world. A good number of small and larger deals have already been agreed. Yes we will need more and yes some may take longer to achieve, but there is a world of opportunity out there.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Thu 31 Dec 2020 12:43 pm
We can also hopefully rebuild our trade with Commonwealth countries which we were forced to let lapse by the EU.PoshinDevon wrote: ↑Thu 31 Dec 2020 12:18 pm
We have a tariff free deal with the EU whilst at the same time we are able to strike trade deals on mutually agreeable terms with the remainder of the world. A good number of small and larger deals have already been agreed. Yes we will need more and yes some may take longer to achieve, but there is a world of opportunity out there.
Since 1992 Australia's gdp growth rate has averaged at 3.2%. EU as a whole isn't even half of that.
No better way to go skint than to tie yourself to a declining sector or industry.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Thu 31 Dec 2020 12:48 pm
mrsgee,
of course the EU and the people of the EU see the downsides... but that was not my point.
i wanted to state the personal aspects.... the people of the EU (either do not care or) are angry with the british people.
the british are one of the richest in the EU.. and still they think it is not enough.
that was one of the reasons eg, Merkel said that a country which is not member of the community can not get better (or equal) conditions as member states.
ETS,
well, yes, we do have a different understanding of democracy. i do not want to live in a country with a "the winner takes it all" mentality. i want "my candidate" to get a vote, yes, and, for the people who also want to have a represented say, i want "my party", my political opinion, to get a vote as well.
proportional representation is the best way, even for a gov, to "realize" whats going on in a country. even if you have to discuss issues with (far) right wingers or with your beloved greens. AfD, liberals, greens, lefts and even parts of the social dems sit in our parliament mainly because of proportional representation (and of course some conservatives as well)
so, in a 4-5 years period, i have 2 votes in a general election. 1-2 votes in my federal country election, 3 votes in a county election + 1, if necessary, run off vote. that represents a micro, medium and macro view of the actual situation in a country. btw, it was the americans, the british and the french who supported this system after WW2.
and this system was transferred for the election of the EU parliament as well (+ minority protection).
as for the identity.... it took a very long time until families became villagers, villagers became, eg, english and/but when i see that in (UK) FB forums maps of england (and not UK) are shown, i doubt that many english became british. that applies for many of the scottish, welch, irish as well.
no doubt that many completely fail to see the bigger picture...
ok, that was off topic. turkey in general will deal in dollar or euro. if you are lucky in GBP, for diversification, but this most probably is up to the trading companies.
posh: your election system pushes the (still also an elephant) UK with sometimes violent force back and forth... and finally you do not know any more where you are and where the right direction is. thta was one of the main questions of the EU to the british, even in the brexit negotiations: what actually do you want? i think it is not clear yet.
of course the EU and the people of the EU see the downsides... but that was not my point.
i wanted to state the personal aspects.... the people of the EU (either do not care or) are angry with the british people.
the british are one of the richest in the EU.. and still they think it is not enough.
that was one of the reasons eg, Merkel said that a country which is not member of the community can not get better (or equal) conditions as member states.
ETS,
well, yes, we do have a different understanding of democracy. i do not want to live in a country with a "the winner takes it all" mentality. i want "my candidate" to get a vote, yes, and, for the people who also want to have a represented say, i want "my party", my political opinion, to get a vote as well.
proportional representation is the best way, even for a gov, to "realize" whats going on in a country. even if you have to discuss issues with (far) right wingers or with your beloved greens. AfD, liberals, greens, lefts and even parts of the social dems sit in our parliament mainly because of proportional representation (and of course some conservatives as well)
so, in a 4-5 years period, i have 2 votes in a general election. 1-2 votes in my federal country election, 3 votes in a county election + 1, if necessary, run off vote. that represents a micro, medium and macro view of the actual situation in a country. btw, it was the americans, the british and the french who supported this system after WW2.
and this system was transferred for the election of the EU parliament as well (+ minority protection).
as for the identity.... it took a very long time until families became villagers, villagers became, eg, english and/but when i see that in (UK) FB forums maps of england (and not UK) are shown, i doubt that many english became british. that applies for many of the scottish, welch, irish as well.
no doubt that many completely fail to see the bigger picture...
ok, that was off topic. turkey in general will deal in dollar or euro. if you are lucky in GBP, for diversification, but this most probably is up to the trading companies.
posh: your election system pushes the (still also an elephant) UK with sometimes violent force back and forth... and finally you do not know any more where you are and where the right direction is. thta was one of the main questions of the EU to the british, even in the brexit negotiations: what actually do you want? i think it is not clear yet.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Thu 31 Dec 2020 1:05 pm
The first past the post system is not without flaws and to paraphrase Churchill (a genuine Churchill quotekibsolar1999 wrote: ↑Thu 31 Dec 2020 12:48 pm
proportional representation is the best way, even for a gov, to "realize" whats going on in a country. even if you have to discuss issues with (far) right wingers or with your beloved greens. AfD, liberals, greens, lefts and even parts of the social dems sit in our parliament mainly because of proportional representation (and of course some conservatives as well)
) its is probably the worst system there is apart from all the others.Proportional Representation like Communism is a system that sounds wonderful on paper but doesn't work in practice.
Check how many governments Italy has had since the war.
It sounds very fluffy that you may have discussions with extremists but what if it goes further than that? In the UK in 2017 we had the situation where the Conservative party had to strike a deal with the DUP to form a government. Imagine if they had to strike a deal with the BNP? In a mish mash of a government that PR generally brings the 2 or 3 seats that extremists will hold become far more powerful than they would in a first past the post system.
I think if we (as their second largest trading partner) insist on dealing in sterling instead of dollars or euros then I think they'll find a way.kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑Thu 31 Dec 2020 12:48 pm
turkey in general will deal in dollar or euro. if you are lucky in GBP, for diversification,
Not to eventually become a state in a super state or at least if that is what the British people clearly want they are entitled to vote for it.kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑Thu 31 Dec 2020 12:48 pm
thta was one of the main questions of the EU to the british, even in the brexit negotiations: what actually do you want? i think it is not clear yet.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Thu 31 Dec 2020 1:49 pm
well yes, italy.. the "general anti example"... do you fear that the UK is like italy?
anyway, it is more than funny to believe that the three allies US,UK and France introduced/supported an election system for germany based on communist ideas.
btw, if a good proportion of the citizens ARE actually right wing or further, it makes no sense to hide them. give them a say.. then you can ask them and they also have to give answers. if they are against constitution, the people can ban them from elections.
yes yes... that was part of all the questions from the EU...
"well, we know what you do not want.. but pls could you tell us what you want?"
answer UK: well, we do not know and it might change by 180 degree in 2 years because 3% of our population changed mind, which may lead to a 2/3rd majority in parliament against us.
anyway, it is more than funny to believe that the three allies US,UK and France introduced/supported an election system for germany based on communist ideas.
btw, if a good proportion of the citizens ARE actually right wing or further, it makes no sense to hide them. give them a say.. then you can ask them and they also have to give answers. if they are against constitution, the people can ban them from elections.
yes yes... that was part of all the questions from the EU...
"well, we know what you do not want.. but pls could you tell us what you want?"
answer UK: well, we do not know and it might change by 180 degree in 2 years because 3% of our population changed mind, which may lead to a 2/3rd majority in parliament against us.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Thu 31 Dec 2020 2:14 pm
Thought this might help a few through the next couple of days/weeks/months/years....
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-55348994
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-55348994
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Thu 31 Dec 2020 2:17 pm
The deal is done.
In less than 12hrs we trade with the EU on the deal agreed. We agree our own trade deals with the rest of the world.
The “doomsayers” can say what they want, it really does not matter. If there are those in Europe that are glad we have left the EU then fine with me, however I suspect for the majority of us we will just rub along fine.
Come back in 5 years and debate how well or badly the U.K. or EU has done.
In less than 12hrs we trade with the EU on the deal agreed. We agree our own trade deals with the rest of the world.
The “doomsayers” can say what they want, it really does not matter. If there are those in Europe that are glad we have left the EU then fine with me, however I suspect for the majority of us we will just rub along fine.
Come back in 5 years and debate how well or badly the U.K. or EU has done.
Re: New Trade deal between Turkey and UK
Posted: Thu 31 Dec 2020 4:02 pm
Nope as long as we don't copy their electoral system. And the wonderful thing is now it is less likely that a group of countries can bounce us into a different electoral system in the future.kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑Thu 31 Dec 2020 1:49 pm
well yes, italy.. the "general anti example"... do you fear that the UK is like italy?
Talking of electoral systems, here's a question I know how a majority of Britains can vote to remove Boris Johnson, how do a majority of Germans vote to remove Ursula von der Leyen?
A communist idea like burying a country's identity into a group dogma? I'm trying to think of a body that reminds me of that.kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑Thu 31 Dec 2020 1:49 pm
anyway, it is more than funny to believe that the three allies US,UK and France introduced/supported an election system for germany based on communist ideas.
It'll come to me.
Would you categorise the AFD as a right wing or further party? If so how are the plans going to have them banned?kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑Thu 31 Dec 2020 1:49 pm
btw, if a good proportion of the citizens ARE actually right wing or further, it makes no sense to hide them. give them a say.. then you can ask them and they also have to give answers. if they are against constitution, the people can ban them from elections.
Remind me are they the 2nd or 3rd largest party in Germany now? But hey it's your affair as a German not mine.
Well I've told you what I want, I can't speak for others but I suspect many feel the same.kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑Thu 31 Dec 2020 1:49 pm
"well, we know what you do not want.. but pls could you tell us what you want?"
answer UK: well, we do not know and it might change by 180 degree in 2 years because 3% of our population changed mind, which may lead to a 2/3rd majority in parliament against us.
Ah yes we will change our minds. Like we changed our minds by the 2019 election where Johnson's promise to get Brexit done as opposed to Labour's policy of who knows what was so unpopular that seats that had been Labour for decades voted Tory to get Brexit done.
But should the EU return to being what was sold to us then maybe the British people will want to rejoin it.
That's the point if you buy what it say's on the tin and what is in the tin is different then a lot of people return it for a refund.