Kibkom North Cyprus Forum

Good Morning all you very helpful people out there.
I have a new room I am wanting to cool down in the summer. I cannot install an external A/C wall mounted unit.
Have any of you had experience with room coolers, some have water I think, if so I would very much like some feed back comments of how good/bad they are and what makes you recommend. The room is approx 5 x 6 mtrs.
Thanks all
Tanky

Freeze water in empty plastic drinks bottle, like 1 litre coke bottles, arrange them in V formation on a plastic tray in front of a fan... the air will be cooled for quite some time. Whilst it's running freeze a batch of replacements

Groucho wrote: ↑

Sun 17 Sep 2023 10:07 am

Freeze water in empty plastic drinks bottle, like 1 litre coke bottles, arrange them in V formation on a plastic tray in front of a fan... the air will be cooled for quite some time. Whilst it's running freeze a batch of replacements

to heat/cool 1 liter of water 1 degree, you need (approx) 1,2 Wh.
cool down the coke bottle from , say, 30 degree to - 20, the "stored energy" in this bottle is therefore 1liter x 50 degree x 1,2 Wh = 60 Wh.
10 bottles= 600 Wh

even if you can manage to cool down 10 bottles in one hour to - 20 degrees two or three times, it will be certainly not sufficient to cool a 5 x 6 x 3(?) meter high = 90 cubicmeter room, which is, obviously, surrounded by other rooms /walls with some sort of a "thermal mass" which will absorb all cooling immidiately and will start to coll the "other rooms" as well...
it is a useless suggestion.

You can buy portable ac unit on wheels. Why can’t you put the compressor out side then

gates wrote: ↑

Tue 19 Sep 2023 8:18 am

You can buy portable ac unit on wheels. Why can’t you put the compressor out side then

if you use an ac unit on wheels, you need to lead the heated air to the outside. also, there will be a suction, so, warmer air from somewhere else will come into the room ...

Ac takes the warm from the room through the ac unit cooling it down so what are you talking about

kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑

Tue 19 Sep 2023 7:58 am

Groucho wrote: ↑

Sun 17 Sep 2023 10:07 am

Freeze water in empty plastic drinks bottle, like 1 litre coke bottles, arrange them in V formation on a plastic tray in front of a fan... the air will be cooled for quite some time. Whilst it's running freeze a batch of replacements

to heat/cool 1 liter of water 1 degree, you need (approx) 1,2 Wh.
cool down the coke bottle from , say, 30 degree to - 20, the "stored energy" in this bottle is therefore 1liter x 50 degree x 1,2 Wh = 60 Wh.
10 bottles= 600 Wh

even if you can manage to cool down 10 bottles in one hour to - 20 degrees two or three times, it will be certainly not sufficient to cool a 5 x 6 x 3(?) meter high = 90 cubicmeter room, which is, obviously, surrounded by other rooms /walls with some sort of a "thermal mass" which will absorb all cooling immidiately and will start to coll the "other rooms" as well...
it is a useless suggestion.

I think you'll find it rather depends on several factors:

What your expectations are?
How long you want to cool it?
Is it just so you can fall asleep?
Whether you want a relatively small heat reduction?
Whether you plan to sit/lie in the path of the cooled air?

My suggestion, which you summarily dismiss as a waste of time is used in hot countries around the globe where access to ac is not readily available, is not suggested as a substitute for ac. The thread starter wanted something not ac based.... what's your suggestion?

gates wrote: ↑

Tue 19 Sep 2023 2:59 pm

Ac takes the warm from the room through the ac unit cooling it down so what are you talking about

the heat (of the room) must go somewhere.
with the common used split units, the heat is transferred from inside unit to outside unit. they are connected with copper cables , inside is the transfer medium, (liquid) gas.
warmer gas is cooled down in outside unit, the cold gas is then warmed up (and cools the room) in inside unit.

a portable ac unit, in which inside unit and outside unit are combined, needs a possibility to get rid of the heat. thats usually is an air pipe to the outside, a fan blowes the hot air out.
suction applies.

The thread starter wanted something not ac based.... what's your suggestion?
[/quote]

the thread starter: I have a new room of 30 m² and I am wanting to cool it down in the summer.

does not sound like "half a degree sometimes, maybe shortly before i go to bed"

solution: an heat insulated duct to the outside. not too long for 100mm, or bigger (200mm) diameter. needs to be checked.
why heat insulated? because the duct will become hot.
a portable ac unit makes a hell of a noise.

still suction applies.

all this suggestions here with "ice cubes" will not work.
and if you place a hundred coke bottles in the room, another problem will arise, humidity.
when you cool down a room (air) you do not only need to get rid of the heat, you are also in need to get rid of the humidity.

thats the reason why also "evaporation coolers" (the ones with water) can not be used inside.

kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑

Tue 19 Sep 2023 5:55 pm

The thread starter wanted something not ac based.... what's your suggestion?

the thread starter: I have a new room of 30 m² and I am wanting to cool it down in the summer.

does not sound like "half a degree sometimes, maybe shortly before i go to bed"

solution: an heat insulated duct to the outside. not too long for 100mm, or bigger (200mm) diameter. needs to be checked.
why heat insulated? because the duct will become hot.
a portable ac unit makes a hell of a noise.

still suction applies.

all this suggestions here with "ice cubes" will not work.
and if you place a hundred coke bottles in the room, another problem will arise, humidity.
when you cool down a room (air) you do not only need to get rid of the heat, you are also in need to get rid of the humidity.

thats the reason why also "evaporation coolers" (the ones with water) can not be used inside.
[/quote]

The frozen water does not evaporate, it remains in the sealed bottles, and any airborne vapour that condenses on the bottles runs down into the collecting tray for disposal. Have you tried it?

The frozen water does not evaporate, it remains in the sealed bottles, and any airborne vapour that condenses on the bottles runs down into the collecting tray for disposal. Have you tried it?
[/quote]

i did not talk about the condensing (dew point) water running down bottles.
some of this water immediately will evaporate again, especially when you use a fan...
the bottles will become warmer and less condensing will apply.
finally there will be only little water to collect.

when you cool down a 90 m³ room , say from 35 degree to 25 degree (in cyprus summer climate) , you have to get rid of, say, 2 liters of water.
if not, the humidity will rise to, say, nearly 100%.
a cold sauna. a 25 degree hamam.
there are tables available to see degree, humidity and water content (and dew points)

plus, of course, on top there will be "normal sweat" from people in the room.
opening doors and windows are, of course, also not permitted.

kibsolar1999 wrote: ↑

Tue 19 Sep 2023 9:56 pm

The frozen water does not evaporate, it remains in the sealed bottles, and any airborne vapour that condenses on the bottles runs down into the collecting tray for disposal. Have you tried it?

i did not talk about the condensing (dew point) water running down bottles.
some of this water immediately will evaporate again, especially when you use a fan...
the bottles will become warmer and less condensing will apply.
finally there will be only little water to collect.

when you cool down a 90 m³ room , say from 35 degree to 25 degree (in cyprus summer climate) , you have to get rid of, say, 2 liters of water.
if not, the humidity will rise to, say, nearly 100%.
a cold sauna. a 25 degree hamam.
there are tables available to see degree, humidity and water content (and dew points)

plus, of course, on top there will be "normal sweat" from people in the room.
opening doors and windows are, of course, also not permitted.
[/quote]

So you can't suggest a solution....

So you can't suggest a solution....
[/quote]

if it would be "so easy" why people would buy (wall mounted - split unit ) air conditioners?

you did not read my comments:
a portable ac unit (attention: often cooling function only, no heating...) , can be a solution, but it needs a duct to the outside.
the noise and the less efficiency (from suction and in general) is to be accepted (or not) as well.

what was your suggestion? ice cubes?
does not work.
i explained why.

A friend of mine has a couple of portable air coolers she bought a few years back, worked on same principle as Groucho suggests, similar size to a dehumidifier, open a drawer, fill with ice and switch fan on, I borrowed one for a couple of weeks and was quite impressed with it, I tried to buy one from various appliance shops including the one she bought hers from but they said they were made in China and had a number of problems with them so they had stopped importing them.

WOW. Thanks all for comments etc. I did not think this topic would raise so many near arguments. Thanks for all the replies. The reason why I cannot go to an outside wall is because the new room has been converted from the old garage. The only wall space available is a ring beam some 75cm thick full of 22mm re-bar. I could go through the roof of the room up into a patio of room above. However the main point I was after was If people out there had OR were familiar with the stand alone room coolers. If so what was their experience with them. I do know some of them work like a cloths dries and work on a self condensing method so no need to vent out through a wall. Thanks Grouch for the iced water but I am after something more advanced.
Of course I should have taken this into account when I had the extension then I could have had the builder sort this one out. But I am where I am.
So do any of you have a room cooler or knowledge of them? Thanks all. Tanky

Daily minimum wage = 835TL - cost of Punkah Wallah would not be cost effective - lol.

Tanky wrote: ↑

Wed 20 Sep 2023 11:26 am

WOW. Thanks all for comments etc. I did not think this topic would raise so many near arguments. Thanks for all the replies. The reason why I cannot go to an outside wall is because the new room has been converted from the old garage. The only wall space available is a ring beam some 75cm thick full of 22mm re-bar. I could go through the roof of the room up into a patio of room above. However the main point I was after was If people out there had OR were familiar with the stand alone room coolers. If so what was their experience with them. I do know some of them work like a cloths dries and work on a self condensing method so no need to vent out through a wall. Thanks Grouch for the iced water but I am after something more advanced.
Of course I should have taken this into account when I had the extension then I could have had the builder sort this one out. But I am where I am.
So do any of you have a room cooler or knowledge of them? Thanks all. Tanky

the problem is, Tanky, that a "room cooler" has no power. if it would work, we all would have one... or 5.

see, a small split unit starts from, say, 9000btu/h, thats approx 2,6 kW cooling power.
but a "room cooler" has a 30 or 50 W fan which circulates around some cold water which evaporates. or some frozen coke bottles which absorb the heat. thats all.
you have to sit in front of the "cooler" and basically a bigger ventilator would do a better job.
none of those "room coolers" will give you a rating for the "cooling power", meaning: the measurable drop in room temperature is small or non existing...

drill through the roof towards the patio and go for a split unit who can manage the distance and height difference.
mitsubishi maybe?

waddo wrote: ↑

Wed 20 Sep 2023 2:48 pm

Daily minimum wage = 835TL - cost of Punkah Wallah would not be cost effective - lol.

Do you know how many candles i would need to heat my room in winter

What's a "Punkah Wallah" do you plug it into the mains or is it ice water based solution?

tutor4u wrote: ↑

Thu 21 Sep 2023 5:51 am

What's a "Punkah Wallah" do you plug it into the mains or is it ice water based solution?

In India, the punkhawallah or pankha wallah was the servant who operated the fan, often using a pulley system. In modern use, a person selling, repairing or making fans, both handheld and electric, would also be known colloquially as a punkha wala, since the term means fan guy or the guy with the fans.

What's a "Punkah Wallah" do you plug it into the mains or is it ice water based solution?

This was supoosed to be a JOKE, in an attempt to COOL Down the Posts

This was supoosed to be a JOKE, in an attempt to COOL Down the Posts
[/quote]

that also can not work.
the energy content of a post is too high to cool it down.

TAC, heating is off topic! It's all about how to get cool - BUT - just for fun - https://heatertips.com/how-many-candles ... at-a-room/