Advice Required

[war horse]

Hi am new to the forum, and l am flying over next week to look at some properties. I have never been before so any advice would be grateful. Will be viewing all over the island and lots of different types. I have done my research and fully understand tbe buying process etc but one of my concern is Water Supplies? is this still a problem and what sort of water charges are there. Also the cost of electric and council tax. Will it be similar to Turkey or a lot more expensive.

Many thanks

[Keithcaley]

One piece of advice only: -

"Rent, don't buy until you've lived here for at least a year"

That way, you may actually achieve a 'full understanding' of the buying process, because if you are currently considering buying, then you almost certainly do not have such an understanding, you would be running full pelt in the opposite direction

[ozankoys]

Firstly welcome to the Forum we hope you have many happy times in TRNC.
Good advice from Keith (as always) rent not buy is the best thing to do. You will find that water & electricity are phenomenally more expensive than Turkey. It depends very much on your accommodation & how you live as to how much you will pay for these utilities. It also depends on the area as to whether your water supplies are continuous or not the Turkish water is not island wide yet.
Council Tax is minimal 1TL per sqm + additional sum if you have a pool.
Sorry to be so vague but if you are looking at properties you could enquire as to what the current occupants' pay for their electricity & water.

[niceone]

If buying a resale make sure the seller has the Kocan. Be very wary of new builds that is where most people have lost money due to the developers mortgaging the property/land then selling it but not paying of the mortgage
good luck

[war horse]

By Kocan is this the same as Iskan/Habitation Certificate? as l assume you would need it to get your utilities regisered,
if not please can you explain what it is,

thanks

[Keithcaley]

By Kocan is this the same as Iskan/Habitation Certificate? as l assume you would need it to get your utilities regisered,
if not please can you explain what it is,

thanks

No, it's not the same, it's the 'Title Deeds' to the property.

Do you know about: -

Obtaining 'Permission to purchase' (PTP)?

Who applies for PTP?

That the Military have the power of Veto on PTP?

That they use that power frequently - and unpredictably?

How long it takes?

That you cannot receive the Koçan until PTP is granted?

That the house remains the Legal Property of the Vendor until such time as the Koçan is issued in your name?

That there is no legal mechanism to force the Vendor to transfer the Koçan. even if the house has been paid for, in full?

That Avukats have no 'Duty of Care' to their clients?

That Banks will issue mortgages (loans) on property to the existing landowner, regardless of whether there is a sale in progress?

That you would probably not find out about the loan until 10 years down the line, after sufficient interest arrears had accumulated to make it worthwhile for the Bank to force an Auction of the property and make a handsome profit (while you lose your house)?


That your Contract is not worth the paper that it's written on?

You didn't know that?

Better start running then, because that's only the half of it!

[sophie]

With the very greatest respect WarHorse, and please, I'm not being rude) I actually don't think you know anything like as much as you think you do about purchasing property here your basic question regarding definition of a Kocan, just proves it. Keith has hit the nail on the head, his remarks are just a fragrant nosegay of what you need to know in advance. Sad to say, there are thousands of us, who thought we knew what we were doing when we moved here in 2005, but in reality we actually knew nothing. Now of course there is much more information available on the web etc., but more importantly on Forums such as this. Ignore the information you read at your peril, as we do know what we are talking about. We've done it and got the T shirt and still paying for it all these years later.

[Groucho]

War horse needs to search this site for 'property auction' to see the tales of woe.

If you purchase an existing property with full title in the name of a vendor who is not Cypriot then much of the minefield will be untrodden. Also when drawing up a contract with a lawyer in addition to your purchase contract - NB if they say you don't need one, find another lawyer - make sure the contract includes a duty of care. Don't let your lawyer draft it... he will fill it so full of holes and get out clauses....

[war horse]

For those of you with the helpful information thank you, and yes "I DONT KNOW IT ALL" I have been trawling as many sites for information looking for answers that why l tried this forum. I have had several properties in Turkey for many years which is different to Northern Cyprus it comes with just as many problems. And yes l understand Titles Deeds and other things but the word Kocan is a word l did'nt know. Perpaps it would be better not to ask advise from others as l did'nt expect the comments l have received. And perhaps its not as nice as l was hoping in Northern Cyprus if some of these harsh comments are anything to go by

[jofra]

Just another "minor" (!) detail regarding Kocan (or title deeds) - I'm lucky,everything went smoothly for me (in just 18 months) from seeing property to having the title deeds to my apartment - however, my current title deed is actually for 1/40 of the site (there are 40 apartments on the site) - and all we residents are now in the process of "parcelisation" - the "splitting up" into individual deeds for each apartment...
Everything is so simple here....

[Medjoul1]

Hello Warhorse,
Welcome, but a warning as to the "Legal advice" which you will be expected to pay more for in the TRNC than the UK for simple conveyancing. As mentioned previously, your "Legal advisor" (who no doubt will be recommended by the Estate Agent if there is one) has No Duty Of Care and although it has become custom and practise to refer to them as Lawyers or Solicitors, the vast majority are nothing of the sort and are simply "Legal Advisors". If you are disatisfied with their advice it will be impossible to take redress as the Law Society here will not sanction it. As regards the "Law" here it really is the wild west, do not have a Kyrenia Legal Advisor, go to Lefkosia for the service or better join the British Residents Society and use one from their recommended list. Wishing you the best of luck in your venture.

[Groucho]

The British High Commission's web site has list of recommended lawyers which at best means they should act for you..

[PoshinDevon]

I would endorse the recommendation to rent before purchase plus the list that Keithcaley posted is very relevant. In our case having lived and worked on the island for many years prior to purchase we did not think that the need to rent was necessary as we felt we understood and had experience of the culture, history and the way things operated.

However, despite what you may think, all is not doom and gloom providing you do a lot and I do mean a lot of research then you should be ok. I read you have purchased a few properties in Turkey, so I am sure you do have some experience of the pitfalls that could happen and are just looking for a better understanding of the process here in North Cyprus.

There are many who have no doubt fallen foul of unscrupulous sellers, builders, legal representatives or estate agents and one can fully understand their anger but there are many who have bought and had no major problems. It's not about luck it's about research and constantly asking questions and insisting on answers and speaking to those who have gone thro the purchase process. Be prepared to walk away if you don't like what you are hearing no matter how tempting your dream property is. There are plenty of other properties available.

In our case we were satisfied with the legal advice obtained and things went smoothly. We purchased 6 years ago and from making the offer to purchase was only a matter of 8 weeks....permission to purchase took us 14 months. We would use our legal advisor for a future property purchase, however if it were a more complicated legal matter then no we would look elsewhere. I would highlight that it is important to have a legal representative not linked to the builder, seller or estate agent.....it's so easy just to go with the estate agents suggestion but be cautious of this. Our legal representative was recommended to us by others who had bought property. We bought from a seller who proved they had their "kocan" and everything was in order and ready to transfer once we had obtained PTP. Our research revealed that residents around us has also received their documentation. We also did as much research as we could on the builder and whilst this took time it did satisfy us that they were reputable- they are still building today.

Don't get put off, you are asking the right questions for sure - it's a great place to live and we have no regrets.

[frontalman]

We bought a donum (and a bit) of land and had a builder build a house to our specification. This is an option which may prove less risky, provided your lawyer is totally independent of the parties you are dealing with, and he/she carries out all necessary background checks.

[Groucho]

We bought a donum (and a bit) of land and had a builder build a house to our specification. This is an option which may prove less risky, provided your lawyer is totally independent of the parties you are dealing with, and he/she carries out all necessary background checks.

This still a risk... there are assumptions like the necessary background being carried out. Who knows until the sh1t hits the fan and the lawyer shrugs...

FM your experience has been positive but I know of Cypriots who owned their own land who have been shafted by a series of builders.

So wh if you really are determined to buy - rather than risk being the owner of a part-built poorly constructed disaster I would recommend you only buy a resale from a non-Cypriot with full title deeds. That way PTP pitfalls, title and dodgy builders are all circumvented.

[kerry 6138]

We bought a donum (and a bit) of land and had a builder build a house to our specification. This is an option which may prove less risky, provided your lawyer is totally independent of the parties you are dealing with, and he/she carries out all necessary background checks.

This still a risk... there are assumptions like the necessary background being carried out. Who knows until the sh1t hits the fan and the lawyer shrugs...

FM your experience has been positive but I know of Cypriots who owned their own land who have been shafted by a series of builders.

So wh if you really are determined to buy - rather than risk being the owner of a part-built poorly constructed disaster I would recommend you only buy a resale from a non-Cypriot with full title deeds. That way PTP pitfalls, title and dodgy builders are all circumvented.

Lately PTP has been refused on Turkish tile properties even when previous owners were non Cypriot.

[Groucho]

We bought a donum (and a bit) of land and had a builder build a house to our specification. This is an option which may prove less risky, provided your lawyer is totally independent of the parties you are dealing with, and he/she carries out all necessary background checks.

This still a risk... there are assumptions like the necessary background being carried out. Who knows until the sh1t hits the fan and the lawyer shrugs...

FM your experience has been positive but I know of Cypriots who owned their own land who have been shafted by a series of builders.

So wh if you really are determined to buy - rather than risk being the owner of a part-built poorly constructed disaster I would recommend you only buy a resale from a non-Cypriot with full title deeds. That way PTP pitfalls, title and dodgy builders are all circumvented.

Lately PTP has been refused on Turkish tile properties even when previous owners were non Cypriot.

Is this urban myth or real... I've heard rumours but never seen actual details...

[kerry 6138]

I have spoken to two purchasers who bought Turkish title this year that this has happened to.

http://www.kibkomnorthcyprusforum.com/v ... it=refused

[suecheshireuk]

Hi, welcome to the forum. As suggested rent first and find your feet. The area you choose may not be the one you want after a year or so. There is alot of building work going on at the moment, including rather noisy hotel, popping up, not to mention the constant smell of sewage. We moved here from Turkey, and it took some getting used to, but just over three years down the line we are happily settled in a nice community, living with the locals. Good luck in whatever you chose to do.

[kaiserphil]

I have spoken to two purchasers who bought Turkish title this year that this has happened to.

http://www.kibkomnorthcyprusforum.com/v ... it=refused

In our block of 6 villas, 2 Brits were approved and 2 were refused, so there was no logic whatsoever in the PTP process.

My PTP was neither approved nor refused by the time I sold up and left. It was "With the Military".

A lawyer told me that they decided to save pre-1974 Turkish Title properties for TCs in case of future property problems.

[The indicator]

We purchased last November and we had our PTP July on pre 74 house

[Keithcaley]

We purchased last November and we had our PTP July on pre 74 house

Is there any possibility that your Nationality or (perceived) religion may have influenced the outcome, do you think?

Rather a silly question, really, as you wouldn't know the inner workings of the system, but I'm reluctant to ask you about your race or religion for fear of appearing prejudiced!

[The indicator]

Not really, it was more to do with Naomi mehmet and her team's professionalism

[war horse]

Well many thanks for the assorted advice. We have paid a deposit on a 2 bed penthouse at Sea Terra Reserve at Tatislu. The property was purchased from a non turk and the individual title deeds are in the owners name. Luckily we bought at a good price and fully furnished so hopefully all will be well and should have the keys very quickly. Will probably be asking for further advice from you all shortly,
many thanks

[tomsteel]

war horse, please seek information on the annual maintenance charge, what it covers etc. I live near Tatlisu and have heard many horror stories of costs and failure to do work. Some people, long term rentals, have actually left because of the problems.

[Cally]

War horse, I had an apartment on Sea Terra Reserve & may I say a good choice, the site is well run & clean. I also used NM for purchase & sale (unforeseen circumstances). It is a lovely area & away from the hustle & bustle around Kyrenia. I still visit but stay in Kyrenia but the traffic is getting worse. I hope you enjoy your new home
The maintenance charges are £840p/a & have been since I bought in 2011.