Gas Water Heater Installer

[wizardofmann]

Hi all, can anybody recommend a good Gas Heater Installer, I just want hot water for the winter, and this option will be cheaper than using my immersion heater,
thanks in advance

[Mimi2]

Carefull what you buy, many of us have these hanging as ornaments on our walls. Great first year then they just get unreliable.

[sophie]

tptally agree with mimi2, there are too many of us with supposed hot water geezers hanging on outside walls. In our case, the company that supplied them, were not aware, and if they were they certainly didn't tell us, that in some cases the properties need major work in the house redirecting piping and direction of flow. Total waste of money in our case.

[judyvin]

I have had one for 4 years with no problems whatsoever. It was supplied and fitted by a company called Ardic near the Bellapais traffic lights. There was some modification to the pipework required and you need to run the water a little longer before the hot comes through but when it does you will have more than you will know what to do with. You can also turn it off easily in the summer months and use the solar heated water. It is very economical to run, using around 2 gas bottles a year and the best thing is that I no longer have to wait for the immersion heater. Money well spent!

[Philoz]

I bought a demirdokum water heater (turkish made,so parts are easy to get) about 4 years ago-not had any problems with it and very cheap to run.

https://www.demirdokum.com.tr/products/ ... en_tr.html

Oz Sogutma (AKA the Scotsman) is an authorised service engineer for them,and he can supply and fit-he speaks good English and his prices are very fair.
Tel- 0392 815 2195 or 0533 868 9066
Hope this helps

[Groucho]

Hi all, can anybody recommend a good Gas Heater Installer, I just want hot water for the winter, and this option will be cheaper than using my immersion heater,
thanks in advance

Ah but will it be cheaper? Work out the sums... how many years before your capital outlay is recovered, factor in servicing, gas usage and the risk of a major fault rendering the installation a costly white elephant and then make an informed decision.

Technological advances in renewable energy may well render the perceived savings a moot point in a very short time.

[waddo]

Philoz,

Good for you, Demirdokum are the best to have here at a reasonable price, made in Turkey and loads of spares when needed. Had mine for years then upgraded to a newer model and had no problems with it at all. Don't have/use solar panels anymore, no top tanks to worry over and use between 1 and 2 big bottles a year in gas so no big gas tank to worry over either. As for Groucho pushing the new tech systems of solar I have done the sums and the break even point against gas V solar is around 10 years - may not be here by then as you need to take your age into consideration as well. If you are between 40 & 60 then go tech, if over 65 then stay with gas seems to be the answer.

[wizardofmann]

thanks everyone for your help

[Groucho]

As for Groucho pushing the new tech systems of solar I have done the sums and the break even point against gas V solar is around 10 years - may not be here by then as you need to take your age into consideration as well. If you are between 40 & 60 then go tech, if over 65 then stay with gas seems to be the answer.

But surely your sums were not based on what now would be more efficient and cheaper given that the renewables industry is constantly making improvements and will have moved...

[waddo]

At the time I did my sums the answer is yes. However, I would be very interested in the sums you must have done yourself to come up with the suggestion of going "Green" at this point in time, given that my age is now in excess of 70 years?

[Groucho]

At the time I did my sums the answer is yes. However, I would be very interested in the sums you must have done yourself to come up with the suggestion of going "Green" at this point in time, given that my age is now in excess of 70 years?

As it happens my sums are not based on using renewable energy - they are based on doing nothing and continuing to use electricity... The difference in power costs over the number of years to recover the initial extra outlay less the number of months in the year when you actually need to use the immersion unit... The cost benefit analysis just does not stack up - then add into the equation the additional maintenance charges and inconvenience of gas bottle delivery and storage.... Then add the risk that gas might outstrip electric costs and new developments in the provision of power may render the decision to try and save money a very negative experience...

At best I would fit one of these to stop the immersion being left on...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Horstmann-E15- ... sion+timer

[waddo]

Did you also factor in a wife and visitors who use hot water and the high possibility of a two hour delay in obtaining sufficient hot water for a family of four to take a decent shower before going out or after sports or other activities? Of course if you only base it on a sunny day and you have efficient solar panels plus a well made hot water tank with a good immersion unit - none of which you will find in a new build here, then you may just be satisfied, that is provided that when your hot has run out your electricity is still on! Yes, you can use your standby generator if you have one but for two hours running to heat a full tank of water against a 20 minute run for a single shower, no brainer. The actual amounts saved vis electric/gas water heating are minimal in anycase. The availability of continuous hot water 24/7 is the requirement - you never know when you would need it. Gas bottle storage is only a problem if you live in a flat - we do not. Gas bottle delivery is not a problem as we collect our own but on the odd occasion when we have had it delivered it has never been a problem - the old system of "One on, One empty, One Spare" cures all problems when a cylinder lasts a minimum of 6 months anyway. For tourists and swallows your system is very viable but for permanent residents I would suggest seeking a better system that doing nothing and continuing to use electricity - when renewable energy takes off then it will be the way to go forward but till then, my water is hot on demand 24/7, happy wife and quite life.

[kibsolar1999]

as i understood , instant gas water heaters need a certain pressure to work properly.
if not, the system often is dedicated to fail very soon. so, electricity cuts still are a problem

if you have a PV solar system ( in a net metering account from kibtek) then the payback is 5-7years.
(no matter whether you have a good or bad solar thermal system or no one at all)

[waddo]

Some do indeed need a certain pressure. The one I have will not function unless mains voltage - or generator voltage - is correct. No mains electric, no hot water but then no mains electric no pump either and as I have no gravity system it makes no difference. Are you saying that if I have a PV solar system fitted that in 5 - 7 years I will have recouped the cost of the whole system (including fitting) by effectively selling back the electricity I do not use to Kibtek, I do understand that Kibtek do not buy the surplus but they do credit me with costs against my consumption charges.

[kibsolar1999]

many gas heaters fail (soon) because people do run the system with gravity pressure from their roof tank (maybe during a power cut only, thats often sufficient to kill them). if you have a good one, with elelctronic control... which measures and only accept a certain pressure... then you also need electric.
so, the argumentation that with a gas heater you have unlimited 24/7 hot water is doubtful.

as kibsolar, of course, i support solar energy... but with solar thermals you really get problems with the payback (especially as a holiday maker).
- you buy cheap (with nearly no hot water in the winter and rusty water) ....you buy expensive ... in any case you have to find a solution for the hot water use in summer. (crazy situation... many people have a solar water heater on the roof, but use elelctric in the summer for heating the washing machine... because there is no hot water connection for the machine anywhere...and even if... it takes 10 liters until the fisrt hot drop would reach the machine )
- solar thermals need good pipe work... who can do that?.. or, who wants to pay for that? (copper)

so it seems, that the classic solution with a storage tank (ok, a good one with better insulation and longer lifetime and better hygiene ) and electric heating element is not bad (maybe with optional solar connections for pre-hating), but, of course, together with a PV solution (net metering) which produces the electric needed for the heater (and for all of the house).

there are also solutions on the market in which a certain amount of PV panels are directly connected to a heating element. this would avoid the expensive piping (at least from solar themels to storage tank), but also prduces the most of the hot water during summer.

the payback of 5-7 years are meant for the elelctric use and solar production, not for the whole system.
a good gas water heater also does cost oney... quite a lot... when you take in consideration that you need a good one and the amount of kWhs you need the heater for...

[waddo]

Having chosen my road to travel, so to speak, I am now committed to gas water heating, right or wrong, cheaper or more expensive it has been my choice. However, this discussion can help many people who have not yet "committed" to one system or another and can be very helpful. If I were due to retire here now - let's say at age 55 - then I would opt for solar energy in one of it's forms, as I must assume that the sun will not run out in my lifetime and that it is a clean and environmentally friendly system. I would also ensure that the correct pipe work to support such a system and therefore gain the maximum benefit from it was also fitted during the build process of my accommodation. To my mind, to do anything else would simply be poor planning for the future! Sadly, I have already retired - have been now for over 10 years - live in a house that has it's interior plumbing already solidly fixed in place and would have been extremely difficult to re-plumb it to retrofit a viable solar system. Indeed the costs involved in such an undertaking were, at that time prohibitive, so I opted for a gas system of a good standard, supported electrically with a standby home generator. It was not an easy project to undertake - being an ex communications and IT specialist and knowing nothing about plumbing - and involved lots of trial and error along with leg work and prayer, but has been completed to my satisfaction for the past three years and works perfectly. The big question was could we survive a power cut and also do without gravity fed water (they go hand in hand for most buildings) and the answer was a generator! I have used my old second hand generator four times in the last 6 six years only - power cuts of less than 6 hours simply give us more time to do gardening - lol.

I have rid myself of the roof/tower mounted cold and hot water tanks and the system of the Cyprus made solar water panels and electric heating element. Water to all parts of the main building is now pressure fed from a 2 ton tank - filled via mains water or well water as conditions dictate - by electrical pump, the main house hot water is supplied 24/7 from a gas water heater that uses less than 2 X 45 Kg gas bottles a year. The utility building water supply is also pressure fed and provided from a separate 1 ton tank - again filled via mains or well water as conditions dictate - the hot water supplied by a very cheap wall mounted gas water heater that uses no more than 1 X 11 Kg gas bottle a year. Gas bottle costs average 400TL per year total. Electricity costs I have no idea of but whole house electricity costs - and we do not stint on lighting, aircon or utilities but have no swimming pool - average out to 185 TL per month. It would be most unfair to put a total cost of equipment and installation charge against this system as it evolved over a number of years and my mistakes were many and costly - lol. However, the cheap water heater cost me 100 TL (second hand 4 years ago) and the good heater cost me 1900TL brand new, I did purchase all the pipe work and fittings (more than I needed) along with the pipe welder gadget (absolute life saver that is) and of course the water tanks but can not remember now how much I paid for them all, at a guess it would not have exceeded 2500 TL.

As I did all the work myself the only costs involved were those of equipment purchases and I had more fun doing it than any of the previous 45 years of working for a living - lol. Not something that everyone could or should do as not all houses are the same - in plumbing fittings anyway. You need a plan to start with and lots of will to succeed but it can be done. My main objectives were to ensure that the maximum amount of water storage and supply equipment was at ground level - I hate working at height - and easily accessible, we would have a constant availability of both hot and cold water to all areas 24/7 and that when I am in the last resting place - my wife would be able to understand it all and fix any simple problems. So far it has proven successful but we have yet to trial the final part - lol.

[oneillbox]

I have recently had a 'demirdokum' gas heater installed. its been fantastic. it senses the temp of the water from your solar tank/pipes and increases it to your 'set' temperature via a gos bottle. 48 degrees is about ok for everything. we are well pleased. total for unit and installation 2200 TL

Glenn from Esentepe maintenance did the job. reliable and efficient.

[Deniz1]

I was happy with mine while it worked! But having to pay someone to climb onto the roof to open and close the solar panel supply twice a year was a nuisance and there seemed a mile of pipework involved.

[sophie]

Deniz1, I know you had yours installed by the same person we had. There was such a rush of enthusiasm from people on the Forum, the bloke was installing 3 a day and was totally out of his depth. He just had a quick look round the house, said "this will do" and fixed to heater to the wall and finished it by torchlight! We have had two people look to see what can be done to make it work and the cheapest quote was 600pounds. The miles of pipes wandering all over the roof is a constant reminder of how we were conned.

[oneillbox]

there is no climbing on the roof to change the pipework between summer and winter, not in my case anyway. basically there are 2 valves underneath the wall unit, turn these on or off as required between seasons. not a problem.

[waddo]

Dependson how your original pipe work was installed! If it goes down the outside of your walls there is no problem, if it goes through the roof into the building then you (could) have a world of troubles. Always the first thing to check before you look at changing!

[Jonnie]

I have Cypriot Solar and a Gas combi boiler with a 500l tank.

Has anyone got an idea of the cost of replacing the Cypriot Solar with PV solar panels?

[waddo]

Kibsolar1999 is probably your man for that Jonnie. That is a good sized tank, is it a good system? Always happy to learn about new stuff available - well new to me anyway - lol.