Hillsborough Disaster

[quality25]

I was actually at Hillsborough on that day. The year before there was a similar crowd congestion. For those who are kind of blaming the Liverpool fans to a degree there are some things you need to know.

1. That ground and the logistics around it were appalling, it was very hard to get to the ground due to bad parking facilities. This caused a lot of fans arriving late for the game.

2. The approach to the Leppings Lane is like a bottleneck which exasserbates any congestion

3. The Liverpool fans who were in much bigger numbers to the Notts Forest fans were given a much smaller end that was rated with capacity far more than should have been in there

4. Our coach arrived 2 hours before the game but it took 45 minutes to get to the ground as there was nowhere near to park. Trains and train stations were also inadequate.

Basically it nearly happened the year before but when Duckinfield opened that gate he caused the deaths of all them people. The whole ground was a death trap. Even when people were pleading to be let out there was no way of speedy evacuation and police used batons on people to stop them escaping from the unbearable crush.

Then the lies that were told and the cover up was disgraceful. A lad called Vincent Fitzsimmons was on our coach and I'll never forget seeing his mum's eyes when she realised her son wasn't on the coach when we got back home. It was a shocking experience solely caused by bad ground, bad access, bad decision making. The only reason more weren't killed was due to the Liverpool supporters all helping out the injured and dying. Nobody stole from dead people, that was such a vile thing to say.
That is the truth of what happened on that day, despite all the tripe that has been written in newspapers. I saw the whole thing unfold and predicted a disaster was going to happen there the year before

[turtle]

My View for what it is worth...

I am from Sheffield born n bred and have been an Owls fan for over 53yrs and watched them home and away through the 70s..80s, 90s & 00s and have to say it was one of the safest grounds I visited during my early years of traveling around, the trouble of hooliganism and bad behaviour around Football in the 70s & 80s lead to the fences being erected on the Leppings lane (away) end and in hindsight was a terrible thing to do and History proves that. Traveling fans in the run up to that fateful day were easily housed in either the centre section or to either side depending on which team visited the seating area above the “Lep” was also usually given to visitors so generally there was plenty of space for traveling fans.

I don’t think we had a game on that fateful day and me and a bunch of mates were in our local pub for the Saturday afternoon “shesh” this pub is 2 miles from the ground and a usual meeting point for home games, that day our pub and I believe many others around the ground area was taken over by Liverpool fans all good humoured and at times really funny Scousers keeping all entertained for the afternoon now I must say at this point that I had no idea if they had tickets or not but what I can say is the fans did not leave that pub until very close to 3.00pm so were never going to make the ground for kick off (we used to leave the pub around 2.30 for a home game) I was told that all the pubs within a 3 mile radius of the ground were heaving with Liverpool fans right up until around 3pm so all I can add is the amount of people arriving late must have been huge ticketless or not.

A sad day for my club

[EnjoyingTheSun]

I must say at this point that I had no idea if they had tickets or not

Every single Liverpool supporter had a ticket for the game.
They will often tell lovable stories of going to ticketless to bunk into other games throughout Britain and Europe but on Hillsborough every one had a ticket.

[Art]

Interestingly there is very little news/media coverage about the current Duckenfield court case.

Given the severity of the alleged offense this is very disappointing.

I wonder why.?

[EnjoyingTheSun]

Interestingly there is very little news/media coverage about the current Duckenfield court case.

Given the severity of the alleged offense this is very disappointing.

I wonder why.?

Personally I think they are charging him with the wrong thing.

I doubt very much they'll get a manslaughter verdict, after all he made an inexperienced mistake which then compounded.

They should have gone for a conspiracy to pervert the course of justice against any involved in the subsequent cover ups.

[Art]

Fair comment which I’m sure wouldn’t be supported by the families of the victims.

I think the CPS had sufficient evidence to prosecute him for man slaughter...

Great pity a lot more of the cover up group got away with it.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

Fair comment which I’m sure wouldn’t be supported by the families of the victims.

I think the CPS had sufficient evidence to prosecute him for man slaughter...

Great pity a lot more of the cover up group got away with it.

Its many years since I studied law but I remember there was a couple of cases where hospital/doctors got away with malpractice suits on the basis that yes they cocked up but then if they had done nothing the person would've died anyhow or something along those lines.

Duckfield could well mount a defense that fair enough I made a mistake opening the gates but had I have left them closed due to the crush people would have died at those gates.

I'm not a lawyer but I think they are going for the wrong crime, Yes he made a mistake but that mistake had been done dozens of times before with no harm. He was inexperienced handling a football match so maybe the suit is better levelled at his employers.

To me the police cocking up was a big factor in the tragedy but their crime was the subsequent cover up of their culpability

[Hector]

May I just ask the 'armchair critics' how many life-changing or rapidly moving, life-threatening incidents they personally been in charge of or had to make quick decisions during?

[EnjoyingTheSun]

May I just ask the 'armchair critics' how many life-changing or rapidly moving, life-threatening incidents they personally been in charge of or had to make quick decisions during?

This is the danger here. If someone making a call in a pressure situation can end up charged with manslaughter a lot will just sit on their hands and let nature take its course. Duckfield undoubtedly made a wrong call here but I doubt he made that call thinking people would die as a result. And if he hadn't made the call would we have had death at the gates he opened?

[Art]

You both make a fair point and as previously mentioned I think the massive police cover up is the real issue and maybe Duckfield didn’t have much of a say in the matter.

[bevron]

Contempt of court.

I am not certain but it may be that the following may apply to this topic. as mentioned above. Social media posts discussing the Hillsborough disaster could land people in prison for up to two years whilst the trial is in progress. Maybe someone with a little knowledge of law may either verify or discount what I have just written. Worth checking out and then let us all know. Bevron.

[Keithcaley]

Contempt of court.

I am not certain but it may be that the following may apply to this topic. as mentioned above. Social media posts discussing the Hillsborough disaster could land people in prison for up to two years whilst the trial is in progress. Maybe someone with a little knowledge of law may either verify or discount what I have just written. Worth checking out and then let us all know. Bevron.

Mr Google says: -
https://www.latrobe.edu.au/nest/social- ... -of-court/

[tomsteel]

Contempt of court.

I am not certain but it may be that the following may apply to this topic. as mentioned above. Social media posts discussing the Hillsborough disaster could land people in prison for up to two years whilst the trial is in progress. Maybe someone with a little knowledge of law may either verify or discount what I have just written. Worth checking out and then let us all know. Bevron.

Mr Google says: -
https://www.latrobe.edu.au/nest/social- ... -of-court/[/quote.

They'll be well pushed to prosecute anybody in the TRNC!

[PoshinDevon]

A number of posts have been deleted due to going off topic.

Please use the pm facility if you wish to communicate directly with another member.

This topic has previously removed temporarily from the forum. The topic will be removed permanently if it is continually taken off topic.

[Art]

Clearly one member has a particular issue with this topic and is using it as a platform for ulterior motives.

Sadly I request you close down the thread which given the level of interest is a great pity.

I will re-open the debate after the Duckfield court case.

[EnjoyingTheSun]

A number of posts have been deleted due to going off topic.

Please use the pm facility if you wish to communicate directly with another member.

This topic has previously removed temporarily from the forum. The topic will be removed permanently if it is continually taken off topic.

The whole contempt of court angle is as off topic as laughing about it, no?